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When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

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The Shadow
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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby The Shadow » Thu Jul 11, 2013 7:35 pm

Spektre wrote:
Yep, I see Quex-Ul strangle Zod to death. That was easy.

Where in the world would you get that Waid was MY sacred cow?

Even IF Superman didn't kill Zod specifically, he killed the other two by unleashing the green K.

My question about Superman's continuity stands as this was only 21 issues into it.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Arion » Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:30 pm

Cat-Scratch wrote:
You know, Spektre is right. It wasn't Superman whom killed Zod. It was Kal-El. There was no Superman at that point in the film, hence the name Man Of Steel instead. :P


Ah, a nice game of semantics. The true weakness of Kryptonians.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Spektre » Mon Oct 28, 2013 4:41 pm

So yeah, I pretty much won this thread hands down.
- Continuity is or it is not. There is no such thing as soft continuity.
- A character IS his continuity.
- Continuity is consistency of the characteristics of people, plot, objects, and places seen by the reader or viewer.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Rockman » Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:22 pm

what do we get for winning threads?

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby bkthomson » Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:44 pm

Rockman wrote:what do we get for winning threads?


A Cookie

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby holtom2000 » Mon Oct 28, 2013 7:43 pm

I do like cookies...
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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Spektre » Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:15 pm

Mmmmm cookies.
- Continuity is or it is not. There is no such thing as soft continuity.
- A character IS his continuity.
- Continuity is consistency of the characteristics of people, plot, objects, and places seen by the reader or viewer.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Draco x » Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:35 pm

I usually hate retcons but the one retcon I did defend was overturning the Ned Leeds as the Hobgoblin fiasco in the 80's and revealing the one true Hobgoblin as Roderick Kingsley.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby habitual » Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:43 pm

Rockman wrote:what do we get for winning threads?


Delusions of grandeur coupled with a false sense of accomplishment.

Hab

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Logan.1179 » Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:49 pm

habitual wrote:
Delusions of grandeur coupled with a false sense of accomplishment.

Hab


Truly the greatest prize there is.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Spektre » Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:35 am

S.F. Jude Terror wrote:
Yes it can, unless the reader is a robot. When people read fiction, they form an agreement with the writer to suspend disbelief and accept the fictional world as a reality of sorts. The writer, in return, agrees to keep the events, characteristics, laws, etc. in this fictional world consistent within itself, at least enough so that the reader is able to immerse him or herself in the reality. Human beings are not perfect, not eve writers, and you're never going to have "perfect continuity." Take, for instance, when a new artist comes onto a comic book. He's going to draw characters slightly differently than the previous artist. Does that make it a new world with new characters? No. We as the readers accept this difference.

With retcons, the agreement between writer and reader has been expanded to account for the generally shared desire to continue telling stories about these same characters in the prime range of their fictional lives. To do that, certain elements of the fictional past that are tied to elements of the real world which make the story unbelievable, shattering the suspension of disbelief, are changed by the writer with the agreement of the reader.

The changes need to not be so egregious as to destroy the agreement for the reader, and often they fail at that (OMD for instance), and there is backlash, but it doesn't change the fact that tweaks and changes to continuity happen all the time, and if they are accepted by the reader, they are part of continuity as we all understand it. Because continuity isn't real. It's a concept in your mind, the culmination of all the stories you've read and how your mind ties it all together.

Just like reality, it's based on your perception. It's impossible for you to perceive it any other way. You perceive it through reading and imagination. The mind is an amazing instrument that will make sense of all that and provide an enjoyable fantasy experience for you.

Unless it's damaged, like yours is.


LOL. The social contract of fiction reading.
- Continuity is or it is not. There is no such thing as soft continuity.
- A character IS his continuity.
- Continuity is consistency of the characteristics of people, plot, objects, and places seen by the reader or viewer.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Spektre » Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:37 am

PDH wrote:
Please attempt to engage with this, Spektre, instead of using your usual tactics. It's spot on and well-written and, frankly, obvious to everyone. Your failure to grasp these points is what makes you wronger than an erection at a funeral.

Pseudo Karma points for Jude!


PDH has bought into the social contract too LOL.
- Continuity is or it is not. There is no such thing as soft continuity.
- A character IS his continuity.
- Continuity is consistency of the characteristics of people, plot, objects, and places seen by the reader or viewer.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Spektre » Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:44 am

PDH wrote:
This is a perfect example of your usual tactics. Nit-pickery, reality-denial, playing dumb, playing smart, condescension, patting yourself on the back for non-existent victories, tediousness, word games, mistaking valid arguments for sound ones, ignorance, repetition, appeal to authority fallacies, appeal to definitions fallacies, etc. etc.

You've learned nothing. You have not used the principle of charity, have made no attempt to understand your opponent's views or engage with them on their own terms and you've bored us all and wasted our time.

People have gone out of their way to engage with your nonsense over multiple threads spanning hundreds of pages and you have not reciprocated in the slightest. You've mentioned a long history of everyone finding your views to be objectionable and absurd, all of which you attribute to their ignorance. Spektre, I beseech you IN THE BOWELS OF CHRIST to please consider the possibility that it might be you rather than everyone else with whom you've ever interacted who is mistaken.


...and what were you doing in the bowels of Christ?
- Continuity is or it is not. There is no such thing as soft continuity.
- A character IS his continuity.
- Continuity is consistency of the characteristics of people, plot, objects, and places seen by the reader or viewer.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby Spektre » Wed Apr 22, 2015 12:48 am

S.F. Jude Terror wrote:Holy crap does Spektre really have 675 posts already? Goddamn.


Over 5000 now!
- Continuity is or it is not. There is no such thing as soft continuity.
- A character IS his continuity.
- Continuity is consistency of the characteristics of people, plot, objects, and places seen by the reader or viewer.

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Re: When a retcon isn't a bad thing.

Postby john lewis hawk » Wed Apr 22, 2015 2:20 am

bkthomson wrote:
A Cookie

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Up the ass.

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