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I Thought There Were No Heroes Before Superman...

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Stephen Day

Wrasslin' Fan

Postby Stephen Day » Fri Dec 15, 2017 12:16 am

...in the current DCU. Isn't that why they started up Earth-2 as a place for their golden age heroes whose past no longer existed?

I thought that was the case. However there have been a couple of instances in series I get in the past little while that makes me think this is no longer the case. In Bug: The Adventures of Forager, the title character traveled back to WWII and had an adventure with some characters including the golden age Sandman. Now, in last week's Black Lightning #2, Jefferson Pierce introduced his trainer. This trainer is an old man who used to be a super villain named Amberjack. Jefferson talked in narrator's boxes about Amberjack's past. He said that when he was active Amberjack fought Captain Compass and the Red Bee.

Like I said, I thought there were supposed to be no super heroes before Superman in the current DCU. When did this change? Was there an announcement that I missed? Did I just misunderstand the situation involving DC's golden age characters? At the moment I'm not sure which is the case.
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IvCNuB4

Staff Writer

Postby IvCNuB4 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 12:57 am

Here we go. :P
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Jack Charlemagne

rubber spoon

Postby Jack Charlemagne » Fri Dec 15, 2017 12:58 am

It's 100% a matter of really poor editing.
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IvCNuB4

Staff Writer

Postby IvCNuB4 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 1:23 am

The real answer is that Rebirth "course-corrected" the crappy New52 timeline back in Action Comics #978 when they merged the New52 and Convergence versions of Lois and Clark. It was a really well done story. I highly recommend it. 8)
Then Flash #21 followed up on that also.

https://www.newsarama.com/34261-spoilers-action-comics-987-clarifies-superman-s-new-continuity-what-s-back-who-s-gone.html
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Eric Ratcliffe

Staff Writer

Postby Eric Ratcliffe » Fri Dec 15, 2017 2:57 am

The blunt version is they basically retconned every stupid decision made during the new 52 for rebirth.
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Spacedog

Expert Post Whore

Postby Spacedog » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:28 am

As the Buddhism says, impermanence is the number one inescapable, and essentially painful, fact of life. That's DC continuity for you. :)

Personally, I think they never had much of a solid plan since 2011, and the motto of Rebirth seems to be "let's bring back everything we discarded with the New 52 and see what works".
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cbikle

Swedish Pinata of Death

Postby cbikle » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:18 am

Also Red Bee is a superhero from the 40's, so this trainer would be close to 100 years old.

I'm guessing that THIS Red Bee is a 2nd generation hero, maybe from the 60's or 70's.
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Spacedog

Expert Post Whore

Postby Spacedog » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:46 am

IvCNuB4 wrote:The real answer is that Rebirth "course-corrected" the crappy New52 timeline back in Action Comics #978 when they merged the New52 and Convergence versions of Lois and Clark. It was a really well done story. I highly recommend it. 8)
Then Flash #21 followed up on that also.

https://www.newsarama.com/34261-spoilers-action-comics-987-clarifies-superman-s-new-continuity-what-s-back-who-s-gone.html

I was reading the explanations for Superman's 'revised origin'. It's a bit like going down the rabbit hole, isn't it? Let's see what it will actually take to solve Superman's nagging feelings that “something is wrong”. But I must say, it never ceases to amaze me how they complicate seemingly simple things.
Image
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cbikle

Swedish Pinata of Death

Postby cbikle » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:53 am

Spacedog wrote:I was reading the explanations for Superman's 'revised origin'. It's a bit like going down the rabbit hole, isn't it? Let's see what it will actually take to solve Superman's nagging feelings that “something is wrong”. But I must say, it never ceases to amaze me how they complicate seemingly simple things.


And one of the primary goals of the Nu52 was to make comics more accessible to new readers, who might find all the old continuity to be too daunting/complicated/confusing.
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Spacedog

Expert Post Whore

Postby Spacedog » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:22 am

cbikle wrote:
And one of the primary goals of the Nu52 was to make comics more accessible to new readers, who might find all the old continuity to be too daunting/complicated/confusing.

Judging by the results, I thought that one of the primary goals of the New 52 was to fuck everything up. :)
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cbikle

Swedish Pinata of Death

Postby cbikle » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:37 am

Spacedog wrote:Judging by the results, I thought that one of the primary goals of the New 52 was to fuck everything up. :)


Also, I remember that the Nu52 was also tied into two other controversial issues (beside the semi-linewide retcon):

1. Renumbering all the issues (pissing off collectors/completionists)

2. The then-plan of moving DC into a mostly digital print media, pissing off all the brick & mortar comics shop owners.
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IvCNuB4

Staff Writer

Postby IvCNuB4 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 3:28 pm

Spacedog wrote:As the Buddhism says, impermanence is the number one inescapable, and essentially painful, fact of life. That's DC continuity for you. :)

Personally, I think they never had much of a solid plan since 2011, and the motto of Rebirth seems to be "let's bring back everything we discarded with the New 52 and see what works".


I agree that the New52 reboot was too much, too fast. Launching 52 new titles at one time was a huge undertaking. Eventually that led to some stories contradicting each other.
After Rebirth launched I read interviews where they admitted the faults of the New52 and learned from that. Rebirth was mapped out from the beginning and very well coordinated between the Editorial groups. You could see that as certain storylines progressed especially within the family of titles for Batman, Green Lantern and Superman , and then with the other associated titles like Wonder Woman, Aquaman and Justice League. A lot of what we are seeing even now was planned out from the start.

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