The Outhouse - The Greatest Comic Book Forum

by **LOLtron** » Mon May 30, 2011 12:30 pm

This month the book club reads the gritty urban fantasy "Sandman Slim" by Richard Kadrey.

Anyone that has read the book is welcome to join in the discussions and reviews!

Cover Blurb:

Life sucks, then you die. Period. Unless you're James Stark, a hitman in Hell for eleven years before escaping back up to Hell-on-earth L.A. -- looking for revenge, absolution... love, maybe. But Hell's not through with Stark. Heaven't not either.

Discuss:

The Outhouse Book Club is an open club anyone is welcome to join and participate as they have time. There is no requirement to read month to month as we choose genre books and anyone is welcome to join the discussion below, whether you are part of the club or not. If you have read the book and want to chime in you can create an account the old fashion way or using Facebook Connect or just fill in the captcha to leave a comment if you don't wish to create your own account.

Written or Contributed by: The Outhouse Book Club

http://173.199.169.70/index.php/reviews/book-reviews/14071-outhouse-book-club-may-sandman-slim.html/

by **~Alima~** » Mon May 30, 2011 7:07 pm

I was really surprised by this book. I thought I wouldn't like it because everyone kept saying how violent it was, but I thought it all fit rather well with the style and I absolutely adored it. I REALLY liked the ending. I love surprises , twists, and funny quips, so I think that made up for the blood and guts. My only problem is the realism of the world. Everyone acts like they woke up on the wrong side of the bed in East LA wearing rival gang colors. I guess once I got used to all the characters and the story that issue seemed to fade, but I was taking it at face value that it was set in real Earth. I don't know if that makes sense.

by **HNutz** » Mon May 30, 2011 7:29 pm

I haven't heard of this, but now I'll look for it.

by **Strict31** » Mon May 30, 2011 7:38 pm

~Alima~ wrote:My only problem is the realism of the world. Everyone acts like they woke up on the wrong side of the bed in East LA wearing rival gang colors.

I believe he does that to let the reader know that nothing is safe or to be taken quite for granted in a world were demons and vampires and zombies (oh yes) exist alongside mankind. There's no one tending the light at the end of the tunnel, basically.

Stark gets along better with folks in the second book. Especially Kasabian. But some of his other relationships take kind of a powder. But at the end of the first book, you can see how his actions have started to actually draw people together.

But Stark is a ghuy who generally rubs everybody the wrong way. On purpose. He's pissed off and is looking for a fight.

And since it's all told from his point of view, that hostility and resentment carries over into the narrative.

by **Allen** » Mon May 30, 2011 8:11 pm

To be honest, I didn't really care for it.

Part of it was I'm just not a fan of urban fantasy for the most part.

Part of it was I thought the religious aspect of the book was pretty cliched and shallow. A lot more could have been done with it, and it could have been handled with a bit more subtlety.

I will also second Alima's comment about the setting. I grew up in LA, even lived in that exact area for over a year. And the description was not very accurate in a lot of ways. It did take me out of the book.

I'll have more another time.

The one thing I will say is that the book was very readable. It moved quickly. Maybe a little too quickly.

by **xaraan** » Tue May 31, 2011 12:28 pm

I loved this book, especially for the first in the series. Usually on urban fantasy it can take a few novels to get me really into it, but I was really liking his take on the character. Pretty interesting take on a character type in a crowded genre.

As for the LA thing. It did come across a bit extreme. But at first u figured he was just in a bad area. Then I figured the Kissi was causing the exaggeration.

by **misac** » Tue May 31, 2011 2:36 pm

I thought I’d be the only one that didn’t like it…

I liked the world he created but Stark kind of ruined the book for me, I didn’t like him at all. Basically he was such a teenager and he used too many similes.

by **misac** » Tue May 31, 2011 2:37 pm

misac wrote:I thought I’d be the only one that didn’t like it…

I liked the world he created but Stark kind of ruined the book for me, I didn’t like him at all. Basically he was such a teenager and he used too many similes.

Also, he totally sucked at getting revenge. When he finally meets up with his sworn enemy he stops to have a conversation with him. :smt102

And he didn’t even kill him, he only killed one of the guys on his list.

by **Strict31** » Tue May 31, 2011 4:18 pm

misac wrote:
Also, he totally sucked at getting revenge. When he finally meets up with his sworn enemy he stops to have a conversation with him. And he didn’t even kill him, he only killed one of the guys on his list.

The whole point is that Stark is still 11 years younger in his own mind. He spent those 11 years in hell, being turned into a warhead that just flies right at whatever is in front of it. When he comes back to Earth, he does the exact same thing. He treats L.A. like an arena, and foolishly assumes all of his enemies are gonna be just like his gladiatorial opponents in the arena.

And in this way, Stark gets played. He gets the ever-loving fuck played out of him. Mason played the fuck out of him. Because he's wired to always move in a straight line at whatever is pissing him off, his enemies (and certain allies) use that against him. Repeatedly. So Mason is not just one step ahead of him; he's all the steps ahead of him.

And no, he doesn't figure this out until he's already left behind a trail of fuck-ups.

When we pick up with the second book, Stark is beginning to learn from his fuck-ups. He starts thinking sideways. Starts using magic to bear the brunt of attacks rather than his face. He still does more reacting than planning, and he still fucks up. But now, he's aware of his flaw, and is working to correct it.

In other words, he's growing. He's learning from his mistakes.

And make no mistake, despite all the villains we see, it's Mason who is the primary black hat in this series. He's the one who's gonna do the monologuing and the outwitting. He's the guy who's gonna have plans within plans and wheels within wheels.

by **~Alima~** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 1:48 am

Ya I understand where he's coming from, how the world might be viewed differently through his eyes, and the emotional growth being stunted, but I would have thought more normalcy in his observations would come through. I guess I was hoping for more of a drastic change in his dark attitude by the end because I didn't realize there were more books to come. How many are there supposed to be?

by **~Alima~** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 1:54 am

xaraan wrote:I loved this book, especially for the first in the series. Usually on urban fantasy it can take a few novels to get me really into it, but I was really liking his take on the character. Pretty interesting take on a character type in a crowded genre.

As for the LA thing. It did come across a bit extreme. But at first u figured he was just in a bad area. Then I figured the Kissi was causing the exaggeration.

Ya sweetie, we'll take a field trip to that area :-)

I always love to visit the areas that stories are based. Go into Steinbeck's area up near Monterrey/ Salinas valley this summer and drink some wine?

by **Strict31** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 1:13 pm

~Alima~ wrote:How many are there supposed to be?

At least three. The second book ain't the end, so presumably a third is on the way.

by **misac** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 1:33 pm

Strict31 wrote:
The whole point is that Stark is still 11 years younger in his own mind. He spent those 11 years in hell, being turned into a warhead that just flies right at whatever is in front of it. When he comes back to Earth, he does the exact same thing. He treats L.A. like an arena, and foolishly assumes all of his enemies are gonna be just like his gladiatorial opponents in the arena.

And in this way, Stark gets played. He gets the ever-loving fuck played out of him. Mason played the fuck out of him. Because he's wired to always move in a straight line at whatever is pissing him off, his enemies (and certain allies) use that against him. Repeatedly. So Mason is not just one step ahead of him; he's all the steps ahead of him.

And no, he doesn't figure this out until he's already left behind a trail of fuck-ups.

When we pick up with the second book, Stark is beginning to learn from his fuck-ups. He starts thinking sideways. Starts using magic to bear the brunt of attacks rather than his face. He still does more reacting than planning, and he still fucks up. But now, he's aware of his flaw, and is working to correct it.

In other words, he's growing. He's learning from his mistakes.

And make no mistake, despite all the villains we see, it's Mason who is the primary black hat in this series. He's the one who's gonna do the monologuing and the outwitting. He's the guy who's gonna have plans within plans and wheels within wheels.

I got that but it still didn't make me like the character.

And another negative, it never felt like he was in peril. With his powers and sweet toys he wasn't really an underdog and kind of had the advantage.

by **Allen** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 1:42 pm

~Alima~ wrote:
Ya sweetie, we'll take a field trip to that area I always love to visit the areas that stories are based. Go into Steinbeck's area up near Monterrey/ Salinas valley this summer and drink some wine?

Mmmm.....Monterey wine country.......

The best Pinot Noirs come from that area, IMO.

by **Chubbles** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 1:47 pm

I really liked this book and I'm glad a few of you did as well. I don't have a formal review or anything cuz I read it over a month ago but I liked it enough to stick with the series. The confrontation with Mason wasn't my favorite part of the book but it was good enough. My favorite aspects was the sex club for angels and his interactions with the head angel chick. They had a cool dynamic going.