The Outhouse - The Greatest Comic Book Forum

by **Doc Jon** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:55 am

Chubbles wrote:I could also write my opinions in a diary but I thought the purpose of a message board was to engage others in conversation/debate about any number of given topics?

Of course, but you would probably agree that certain threads serve different purposes, yes?

There are threads that specifically discuss the incident that everyone seems intent on discussing in this thread. This thread was obviously meant to show some respect for Joe Paterno.

To continue to try and debate it in here just shows the silly aspect of message board posting which is the "look at me" syndrome. There are multiple other threads for you to discuss your POV on this matter ad nauseum. What I continue to wonder is why you, or anyone else, insists on doing it in this thread?

Is it the reasonable plea to take it elsewhere?
Is it the knowledge that running down the man in a thread meant to show him respect will elicit a more forceful reaction?
Or is it just for shits and giggles?

by **Doc Jon** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:58 am

Punchy wrote:
All the other threads were made before he died, you can't say you're glad he died until he actually dies, so I'd say everyone is perfectly within their rights to say what they will about his death.

No one is talking about "rights". Everyone is well within their rights to express their opinion. If you can't understand a reasonable request to take the debate elsewhere, then I really don't know what else to say.

by **Punchy** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:59 am

Doc Jon wrote:
No one is talking about "rights". Everyone is well within their rights to express their opinion. If you can't understand a reasonable request to take the debate elsewhere, then I really don't know what else to say.

Well it's not really up to you to say what people can post is it?

You say this is a thread to pay respects, but I would say Paterno doesn't deserve such a thing. You can't avoid this issue really, it's pointless trying.

by **Chubbles** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:01 pm

The purpose is to find out why so many people can still respect this guy and are willing to so easily overlook this huge scandal and turn a blind eye thinking he deserves any more respect than an average person who played a part in a child molestation scandal. Paterno was the number 1 man on campus for so long, to claim ignorance and be unaware that sandusky had showered with boys and then years later was seen raping one is insane. His excuse is hiding behind the fact he's 'old school', fuck that shit. Not being a snitch goes out the window when kids are being molested.

by **Doc Jon** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:03 pm

LobsterJ wrote:
You can only hold people to realistic standards of what they can be expected to do in any given situation. Nobody expects a hospital worker to follow-up with every person facing a problem they encounter in their work. But if you see clear evidence of sexual abuse and don't report it, then you are a piece of shit. In your situation, reporting it would be all you can reasonably expected to do because 1. You have no reason to think the authorities you are reporting it to have a vested interest in keeping said abuse quiet and 2. You don't exercise a huge amount of power in your facility as Paterno did at his.

Do you personally think Paterno did enough in this situation?

You're now talking about a host of different standards. What power did he have over a man that wasn't his employee and wasn't working at the school? He took away the man's access. He reported the incident to his superiors.

The point is many of can do more constantly. We don't because honestly, we all have our own bullshit. We have our own families and our own lives and our own responsibilities and we don't want to be involved in everyone else's.

I can say that I do my job, and I do, but can I do more? Yes. We all can, but we usually don't. We're human, sometimes in the worst ways. It's why people who behave selflessly can be so amazing.

Sadly, Paterno was just human. I'm sure he made plenty of mistakes, not the least of which was not doing more in this Sandusky situation. But it's easy to crucify a man when you put him under a microscope. Most of us wouldn't survive it.

by **Doc Jon** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:04 pm

Punchy wrote:
Well it's not really up to you to say what people can post is it?

You say this is a thread to pay respects, but I would say Paterno doesn't deserve such a thing. You can't avoid this issue really, it's pointless trying.

Never said it was up to me. That's why it was a request, or is that confusing you?

I agree that it's pointless to ask for respect on a message board as this thread has adequately proven.

by **Chubbles** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:06 pm

You made the request and we did not comply...seems pretty simple actually

by **Doc Jon** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:06 pm

Chubbles wrote:You made the request and we did not comply...seems pretty simple actually

Agreed. Congrats.

by **LobsterJ** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:13 pm

Doc Jon wrote:
You're now talking about a host of different standards. What power did he have over a man that wasn't his employee and wasn't working at the school? He took away the man's access. He reported the incident to his superiors.

The point is many of can do more constantly. We don't because honestly, we all have our own bullshit. We have our own families and our own lives and our own responsibilities and we don't want to be involved in everyone else's.

I can say that I do my job, and I do, but can I do more? Yes. We all can, but we usually don't. We're human, sometimes in the worst ways. It's why people who behave selflessly can be so amazing.

Sadly, Paterno was just human. I'm sure he made plenty of mistakes, not the least of which was not doing more in this Sandusky situation. But it's easy to crucify a man when you put him under a microscope. Most of us wouldn't survive it.

He could have...I don't know, followed up on it? Asked his superiors what happened and why Sandusky's name hadn't been in the papers? And then gone to the ACTUAL police (not the campus police) and let them know what he had been told, so the ACTUAL police could have spoken to McQueary and then to Sandusky and then maybe stopped him from raping kids for another couple of years?

My complaint about Paterno is not that he didn't do more, but that he did as little as he could to cover his ass, as I have said. And yes, we all have your moral failings occasionally, but I hope to God nobody on this boardw moral failings include burying his head in the sand while having knowledge that a child molester was operating a children's charity that allowed him unfettered access to all the at-risk kids he could get his hands on.

I don't know, I guess I can be a little black and white when it comes to child abuse.

by **Doc Jon** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:14 pm

by **Chris** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:33 pm

Doc Jon wrote:
No, but there are other threads to voice what you want to voice. Again, I don't know the purpose of the continued railing against him in this thread. Your opinion has been noted. No one posting in this thread is unaware of the circumstances.

I simply don't see the point.

On the flipside, I don't see the point in continuing to police the thread. It's causing more drama than there would be otherwise.

by **Spidey-Man** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:50 pm

Chubbles wrote:Someone comes to me saying they saw a young boy being raped and this person doing the raping was a close friend of mine, you better be damn sure I'm gonna talk to that friend and clear the air...i'm pretty sure it came out that he never even approached sandusky about it

well he wasnt told told that apparently.

He was appartently told the guy saw something that made him unconformatable.

details were left out

according to paterno

by **ReturnoftheMack** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:10 pm

LobsterJ wrote:
He could have...I don't know, followed up on it? Asked his superiors what happened and why Sandusky's name hadn't been in the papers? And then gone to the ACTUAL police (not the campus police) and let them know what he had been told, so the ACTUAL police could have spoken to McQueary and then to Sandusky and then maybe stopped him from raping kids for another couple of years?

A few things you need to know:

Asked his superiors what happened and why Sandusky's name hadn't been in the papers? Because you just assume that it was a misunderstanding since you can't believe your friend would do that.

And then gone to the ACTUAL police (not the campus police) and let them know what he had been told, so the ACTUAL police could have spoken to McQueary and then to Sandusky and then maybe stopped him from raping kids for another couple of years? The campus police ARE actual police. They aren't security guards. They are a police force. Therefore, he did tell the police.

Let's say Slamburger was accused of rape and you found out about it by someone else. You then called the police. Wouldn't you assume that it was over if they didn't arrest him? Would you do some more follow-up work or would you just assume that there was no merit to the girl's charge?

Would you be able to go to him after and say, "remember the time I called the cops on you for raping somebody? Whatever happened with that?"

by **Chubbles** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:14 pm

I would without a doubt ask a close friend of mine about something like this...even if i went at it with the approach of 'this can't be true, why would they make this up about you...right?'

by **ReturnoftheMack** » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:21 pm

Chubbles wrote:I would without a doubt ask a close friend of mine about something like this...even if i went at it with the approach of 'this can't be true, why would they make this up about you...right?'

You're a hero among men Chubbs.

Now stop wasting time here and make that trade with me in FBB.