The Outhouse - The Greatest Comic Book Forum

by **draco x** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:28 pm

dairydead wrote:

She came to make a stand against Scott, and help the Avengers.
The only Avenger that had an issue with her was Vision.

And what makes you think that she wouldn't have confronted Scott and Emma anyways if the Avengers weren't there? No matter how you choose to spin this, Wanda is with the Avengers at the moment and isn't speaking for them just because she saved their butts. Remember Xavier was also telling Scott that the Phoenix thing was a bad idea as well in AVX#6 but does that he mean he is an Avenger too?

by **dairydead** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:29 pm

draco x wrote:
And what makes you think that she wouldn't have confronted Scott and Emma anyways if the Avengers weren't there? No matter how you choose to spin this, Wanda is with the Avengers at the moment and isn't speaking for them just because she saved their butts. Remember Xavier was also telling Scott that the Phoenix thing was a bad idea as well in AVX#6 but does that he mean he is an Avenger too?

haha apparently this is the only time in comic book history that showing up to save someone, attack that person's attacker and whisk that person away to safety is not any sort of endorsement whatsoever.

by **fieldy snuts** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:58 pm

draco x wrote:
From someone who brought the issue myself, both Hank and T'Challa basically objected to attacking the Phoenix 5. If you actually read the issue you would see both of them objecting at various points throughout the book.

Bullshit.

Panther stands with them in their science team, he just won't attack them publically because it'll be seen as an act of war by Wakanda. As for Beast...he won't do anything until the Phoenix steps out of line.

by **ReturnoftheMack** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:00 pm

draco x wrote:
From someone who brought the issue myself, both Hank and T'Challa basically objected to attacking the Phoenix 5. If you actually read the issue you would see both of them objecting at various points throughout the book.

Who cares if they object? The X-Men attacked the world's military. You can't dispute that regardless what Beast says. :lol:

by **ReturnoftheMack** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:02 pm

draco x wrote:
And the Avengers haven't? How many times has the Avengers stormed Latveria, Genosha, etc? The fact of the matter is neither team is innocent in AVX and Scott and Steve are acting like morons.

This is the argument that we made in the other thread and all you did was reverse it. :lol:

by **habitual** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:39 pm

dairydead wrote:

She came to make a stand against Scott, and help the Avengers.
The only Avenger that had an issue with her was Vision.

That's a huge assumption.

Hab

by **GHERU** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:42 pm

dairydead wrote:

She came to make a stand against Scott, and help the Avengers.
The only Avenger that had an issue with her was Vision.

maybe the only one there
but, I bet, that She-hulk isn't too happy that the witch made her kill the vision

by **draco x** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:02 pm

The President wrote:
Who cares if they object? The X-Men attacked the world's military. You can't dispute that regardless what Beast says.

Did it actually state that they were attacking the military? All we saw was them take dismantle several weapons and vehicles of war. How do you know that they weren't attacked by the military themselves before they dismantled all those ordinances? The only scene that supports your claim was when Emma went to the school to destroy the Sentinel there and the Avengers Academy defended the robot. As I have said before, I am not in the X-Men's corner whatsoever but what Cap and co. did by trying to invade Utopia was a bad move and the plan was stupid all over.

by **draco x** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:06 pm

dairydead wrote:
haha apparently this is the only time in comic book history that showing up to save someone, attack that person's attacker and whisk that person away to safety is not any sort of endorsement whatsoever.

So when Professor X showed up prior that and told Scott that the Phoenix thing was a bad idea, he was acting on the behalf of the Avengers as well then? So next issue we can look forward to seeing Xavier saying Avengers Assemble then. :-D

by **draco x** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:10 pm

The President wrote:
This is the argument that we made in the other thread and all you did was reverse it.

Just like you are ignoring parts of issue 6 to support your argument. The funny thing is that some here think I am supporting Scott and co.'s behaviour but I don't. I am just saying that Cap and the Avengers threw gasolene on a very big fire that is going to burn them in the end. What they inadvertently did was give Scott and co. another reason to kick things up a notch.

by **draco x** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:15 pm

fieldy snuts wrote:
Bullshit.

Panther stands with them in their science team, he just won't attack them publically because it'll be seen as an act of war by Wakanda. As for Beast...he won't do anything until the Phoenix steps out of line.

Aha, you didn't read the issue at all, did you? Black Panther said in the planning room that attacking them without provocation was a bad idea( And that was before Beast objected by the way). He was then seen in the president's oval office saying that the Phoenix 5 didn't do anything and was mentioning the good they were doing and then he said on the plane he wouldn't storm Utopia because of him being head of state. These are 3 different occassions that show that T'Challa never supported his teammates on attacking Scott and company.

by **alaska1125** » Tue Jun 26, 2012 11:23 pm

GHERU wrote:maybe the only one there
but, I bet, that She-hulk isn't too happy that the witch made her kill the vision

Yeah, that played out in Avengers 24.1, I believe.

by **ReturnoftheMack** » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:25 am

draco x wrote:
Just like you are ignoring parts of issue 6 to support your argument. The funny thing is that some here think I am supporting Scott and co.'s behaviour but I don't. I am just saying that Cap and the Avengers threw gasolene on a very big fire that is going to burn them in the end. What they inadvertently did was give Scott and co. another reason to kick things up a notch.

I didn't ignore any parts of the issue. Please point out where I did.

You are the one making wild leaps in your logic.

Nobody said the Avengers are perfect, but Cyclops is a clear villain.

by **ReturnoftheMack** » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:32 am

draco x wrote:
Did it actually state that they were attacking the military? All we saw was them take dismantle several weapons and vehicles of war. How do you know that they weren't attacked by the military themselves before they dismantled all those ordinances?

Come on! It's obvious what was happening on the splash page.

Don't pretend to be oblivious to protect your argument.

Cyclops even said that the world wouldn't be allowed to make more war machines.

And look at the wording T'Challa uses: "They gave the nations an ultimatum." What happens if a nation objects?

Like I've said before, if you support the X-Men because you like the characters more or are a fan, that makes sense. That's why I supported Cap's side in Civil War even though I think the SRA was right. But to say that what the X-Men are doing isn't villainous is disingenuous IMO.

by **fieldy snuts** » Wed Jun 27, 2012 12:37 am

draco x wrote:
Aha, you didn't read the issue at all, did you? Black Panther said in the planning room that attacking them without provocation was a bad idea( And that was before Beast objected by the way). He was then seen in the president's oval office saying that the Phoenix 5 didn't do anything and was mentioning the good they were doing and then he said on the plane he wouldn't storm Utopia because of him being head of state. These are 3 different occassions that show that T'Challa never supported his teammates on attacking Scott and company.

Yet Panther is still around the Avengers in a behind-the-scenes capacity working in conjunction with them albeit out of the public light. Why else would he even be in the plane in the first place? :lol: