The Outhouse - The Greatest Comic Book Forum

by **Juan Cena** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:33 am

doombug wrote:Yes but you know what else that legion had going for it?

The fucking Justice League and the Justice Society helping sell it. And looking back at the stuff Meltzer and Johns wrote...it doesn't hold up, at all.

No one is arguing that they don't want it to succeed, the just don't give a shit about your terminology or sales numbers. I don't get how you can't see that.

How calling it "neo-classic" pi$$es people off is beyond me. The team Johns & Meltzer brought back had more than enough retcons for retcons sake to make it different from the pre-Crisis team. (The connections to Johns' Superman reboot were enough to say it wasn't quite the "real" verision).

Guys like Amoebas and EJF were blasting me because I said bringing the old team "back" as is (for the most part) was the wrong move. I was right in the end.

by **Juan Cena** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:45 am

UnionJack wrote:I've pretty much agreed wholeheartedly with Nacireman on LSH but I've got to say (and the images in this post are the first I've seen of Kolins LSH) that Kolins art looks fantastic. He is one of those artists I'll buy pretty much anything they do.
Had just recently dropped LSH but I think I'll be picking it up again....

You know Giffen is replacing Kollins in a few months, right?

Anyway, we obviously have different views on what "fantastic" is. Personally, I'm not crazy about the more anime/cartoonish styles of penciling. For that kind of stuff to work for me, the artist really needs a good sense of style and vision for me to buy into it. I like Cliff Chiang's stuff on Wonder Woman, for example, because it's reminiscent of ancient Greek art, which is perfect for the book.

Kollins hasn't shown me yet any kind of vision for the 31st century that doesn't feel generic.

by **UnionJack** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:55 am

The Nacireman wrote:
You know Giffen is replacing Kollins in a few months, right?

Anyway, we obviously have different views on what "fantastic" is. Personally, I'm not crazy about the more anime/cartoonish styles of penciling. For that kind of stuff to work for me, the artist really needs a good sense of style and vision for me to buy into it. I like Cliff Chiang's stuff on Wonder Woman, for example, because it's reminiscent of ancient Greek art, which is perfect for the book.

Kollins hasn't shown me yet any kind of vision for the 31st century that doesn't feel generic.

I'm fine with Giffen on art as I love his work too.
So long as he stays away from writing....
As for Kolins I've been a fan of his work since The Flash - best Flash artist since Infantino although Infantino is my favourite. No-one draws speed motion like he used to.

by **Juan Cena** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:33 am

UnionJack wrote:
I'm fine with Giffen on art as I love his work too.
So long as he stays away from writing....
As for Kolins I've been a fan of his work since The Flash - best Flash artist since Infantino although Infantino is my favourite. No-one draws speed motion like he used to.

Emphasis on "used-to." His art the past couple of issues is terrible. His faces look straight out of the comic strips (and not in a good way). Just way too flat and one-dimensional.
And his bodies postilions seemed too awkward. Might work on Flash, but it just didn't here.

by **Arion** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:05 pm

Amoebas wrote:Or use the word "neo"? Or complain about how Jan's costume is too sexy, or bitch about how Dr. Gym'll originally had 4 hours and this has to be a fake, or moan about some crazy thing that he just makes up outta thin air to justify his Legion dementia?

Love the book - love Kolins on it - looking forward to having this in me hands real soon!

On the contrary, Jan's costume should be much sexier. And pink!

by **Amoebas** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:26 pm

Arion wrote:
On the contrary, Jan's costume should be much sexier. And pink!

This sexy enough for you? :-D

by **IvCNuB4** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:05 pm

The May and Sept issues saw an increase in sales and DC hasn't cancelled it yet so can't we all just be glad that there is a Legion title still on the shelves ?

Plus with Giffen coming on that will surely attract more readers, right ?

by **Juan Cena** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:26 pm

IvCNuB4 wrote:The May and Sept issues saw an increase in sales and DC hasn't cancelled it yet so can't we all just be glad that there is a Legion title still on the shelves ?

Plus with Giffen coming on that will surely attract more readers, right ?

Actually it was down - 2.8 % in May. The Sept. increase can be correlated with the #0 issues.

And how'd Giffen on Omac do for sales? I don't think he has quite the star power to generate sales as people around here think he does.

by **UnionJack** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:55 pm

The Nacireman wrote:
Emphasis on "used-to." His art the past couple of issues is terrible. His faces look straight out of the comic strips (and not in a good way). Just way too flat and one-dimensional.
And his bodies postilions seemed too awkward. Might work on Flash, but it just didn't here.

Sorry, when I said 'no-one draws speed motion like he used to' I was referring to Carmine Infantino. I was just making the point that I thought Kolins was the best Flash artist since Infantino.

Still love what I see of Kolins' LSH...

I think you might be onto something about Giffen's popularity. Is he really as big a draw nowadays as some Outhousers think?

No denying he's one of the LSH artist greats but as some posters like to point out, there's only about a dozen of us who care about the Legion enough to get dewy-eyed and excited about past Legion creators to pick up the series because of their return...

by **Juan Cena** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:47 pm

UnionJack wrote:
Sorry, when I said 'no-one draws speed motion like he used to' I was referring to Carmine Infantino. I was just making the point that I thought Kolins was the best Flash artist since Infantino.

Still love what I see of Kolins' LSH...

I think you might be onto something about Giffen's popularity. Is he really as big a draw nowadays as some Outhousers think?

No denying he's one of the LSH artist greats but as some posters like to point out, there's only about a dozen of us who care about the Legion enough to get dewy-eyed and excited about past Legion creators to pick up the series because of their return...

Legion needs to quit the stunt casting with former creators like Shooter or Levitz, (and Waid, if you must add him to the list), and go with some new blood. It needs someone who can handle a large cast, and has a good grasp of what works with comic and SF fans today. I'd like someone who could handle different SF genres, like hard science, steampunk, space opera, military, biopunk, post-apocalypse, etc.

by **UnionJack** » Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:42 am

Kurt Busiek could be good for the Legion - he can certainly do large casts.
Artist is tricky. Could see Jim Cheung being a good fit but he seems to be Marvel only. Can't really think of anyone else.

by **Juan Cena** » Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:36 am

UnionJack wrote:Kurt Busiek could be good for the Legion - he can certainly do large casts.
Artist is tricky. Could see Jim Cheung being a good fit but he seems to be Marvel only. Can't really think of anyone else.

Busiek had had health issues latelym an is busy trying to get a new Astro City series off the ground.

by **Arion** » Sun Nov 25, 2012 4:44 pm

Amoebas wrote:This sexy enough for you?

Let's find more Element Lad shirtless pics !

by **IvCNuB4** » Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:17 pm

Just got around to reading this. Actually the art looks better in the rest of the issue. Some panels, especially with Dream Girl, almost remind me of Marc Silvestri.

by **Arion** » Sat Dec 01, 2012 4:35 pm

UnionJack wrote:Kurt Busiek could be good for the Legion - he can certainly do large casts.
Artist is tricky. Could see Jim Cheung being a good fit but he seems to be Marvel only. Can't really think of anyone else.

Busiek would be GREAT. Besides, he likes the Legion.