The Outhouse - The Greatest Comic Book Forum

[muddyglass]

Arab science & technology was basically built on the Greek and Roman texts that they translated. And it only went as far as Islam would allow it.

(and why are you making it sound like I was backing Niktrist's stupid argument?)

the arab mathematicians contributed to the familiar arabic numerals and place-value system we are still using today, the decimal system. greek and roman mathematics was held back because of their lack of a place-value system. if you've ever done arithmetic with roman numerals, e.g. LXIII + XCVII = CLX, then you'd notice the inherent superiority of the decimal system, e.g. 63 + 97 = 160. descartes' coordinatization of space in analytic geometry would be impossible without this development. the arab mathematicians also made significant contributions to algebra. the words "algebra" and "algorithm" are still around today to honor their work.

one thing i've always liked about mathematics is the idea that a small handful of really smart people of all skin tones worked on building up this beautiful structure over the centuries, to the benefit of all.

[Lord Simian]

Arab science & technology was basically built on the Greek and Roman texts that they translated. And it only went as far as Islam would allow it.

Fairly certain that is not an entirely factual statement.

[Food Eater lad]

Only a small part of it was.

Here's a map of the Empire of Mali around the time of Musa I's rule:



You don't get to run a nation that big by basing the entire economy on slavery. Nations that size simply can't run off of one economy sourse. There was much more than that going on. Plus, most of his gold came from the fact that there was a ton of gold in the ground in that area.

Not a small part, a large part. He was the worlds largest slave exporter of the time, and probably of all time.

[Stephen Day]

Not a small part, a large part. He was the worlds largest slave exporter of the time, and probably of all time.

Which still doesn't match up with the "all of his wealth" that your originally claimed does it?

[Stephen Day]

Which still doesn't match up with the "all of his wealth" that your originally claimed does it?

Besides that, you're trying to claim that he was the biggest exporter of slaves the world has ever known when he lived a good three hundred years before the height of the Atlantic slave trade. Hell, some of the rulers of Zanzibar probably have a better claim to that title

[Zero]

Fairly certain that is not an entirely factual statement.

I think you're in the wrong thread for that kind of talk

[Ntikrst]

How does this explain the early civilizations in Mesopotamia who certainly didn't have to deal with anything like winter. Rome wouldn't have existed without them. You also seem to be forgeting the Ottoman Empire, as well as all of the great Islamic Empires that preceded the Ottomans, not to mention the Indian Empires.

Or for that matter some of the great African empires that you seem to be just ignoring. After all the man thought to have been the richest man the world has ever known was African, Mansa Musa (literal translation King of Kings, but the best translation is Emporer) Musa I of Mali. After all, any man who can go on a hajj (in 1324) and seriously depress the gold market, and by consequence, the economy of the entire country of Egypt for years just by the shear amount of gold he threw around while passing through was seriously rich.

I explained the early civilizations of Mesopotamia in the post you responded to; they received their knowledge in Sumer from those who arrived from the heavens, the Annunaki. Neither the Ottoman's nor the Indians did anything to significantly advance the Sumerian knowledge because there was no imperative for their cultures to survive Winter. This is Why Rome conquered the World and the Ottoman's/Indians just stuck to their climate zones. Rome took that Sumerian knowledge "to the next level" because they have to be smarter to thrive in Winter and the same sort of thing happened in China. The necessity of surviving Winter made those empires stronger than empires that don't have to. Winter isn't the source of the knowledge, it's like 3M, Winter makes the knowledge better.

Now this great African empire you mentioned, collapsed under it's own weight and became extinct before Britain(Rome spin-off) made the entire continent their bitch. By comparison, is the the architecture in Washington DC, London, Paris and Berlin inspired by Roman or Egyptian cultures?

None of your "great" empires from Africa/Ottoman/Indian matter very much in the grand scheme of developing the sacred knowledge from Sumer into the modern civilization we have today because cultures that had to endure Winter were motivated to a greater degree to be more technologically efficient and interdependent on one another.

[Ntikrst]

But long before that those non-white Arabs managed to conquer a great deal of white euro territory during a time when they were more advanced technologically than those white euros. And they did it all without having to deal with winter.

Sorry guys, but my main problem with what you're saying is that it's ignoring whole swaths of history, representing more than half the world, just because they don't fit into your theory.

You're problem is you're so eager to defend your Nationalist Indoctrination that you want to squabble over trees instead of looking at the forest. The Arab States peaked early because they didn't develop their Sumerian knowledge as far as their counterparts in Greece and Rome did. Sure they made some early gains over savages and pestered the West and even did a fine job of developing the Sacred Knowledge to their level of fucking near stone age technology but like most people who peaked early, they were eclipsed by those who took their time to develop their potential further.

Arabs rule the desert, China and Rome rule the World.

[Ntikrst]

the northernmost portion of china experiences harsh winters. however, the southernmost portion of china is actually very temperate and has more in common with egypt as far as the winters go. should the southern chinese be considered "summer" people messing things up for the more able "winter" people of the north?

In the West a Tan is a sign of Affluence because it means that one has enough money to travel to exotic locals. In the East, a Tan is a sign of Poverty because it means one works outside performing manual labour. So what do you think?

Nobody says Summer people mess things up but in the grand scheme of things, Summer people want Winter lifestyles with all the technology and personal freedoms and Winter people want Summer culture for food and entertainment. Those aren't equal contributions to the development of a Modern Society.

in egypt, the deserts become very cold at night. do the egyptians have a "semi-winter" culture because of the harshness of the cold desert nights?

Not much of an incentive when some fire, a tent and warm blankets are enough, is it?

you also singled out northern europe as being special, yet rome itself is located in italy, i.e. in southern europe. how can the culture of the roman people, with a gentler winter, be deemed superior to the survivors of colder winters further north? did the conquered peoples of the north impart culture onto their roman conquerors?

Italy doesn't have gentler Winters because of all it's Mountain Regions inland, away from the coast. There's lots of Ski resorts in Italy and some areas get as cold as Canada in the Winter. That's the difference between them and Greece and why the Romans ultimately conquered them.

it's the little things like this that keep up me up at night, yet the chilly moonlit air doesn't seem to help me unravel the answers to these mysteries.

There are no mysteries as I have just pointed out. Just your willingness to ignore and deliberately misconstrue my argument in order to protect your ego so it doesn't have to admit it has been victimized by the Progressive Socialist Indoctrination that's been in full swing since the 70's.

[Juan Cena]

I explained the early civilizations of Mesopotamia in the post you responded to; they received their knowledge in Sumer from those who arrived from the heavens, the Annunaki. Neither the Ottoman's nor the Indians did anything to significantly advance the Sumerian knowledge because there was no imperative for their cultures to survive Winter. This is Why Rome conquered the World and the Ottoman's/Indians just stuck to their climate zones. Rome took that Sumerian knowledge "to the next level" because they have to be smarter to thrive in Winter and the same sort of thing happened in China. The necessity of surviving Winter made those empires stronger than empires that don't have to. Winter isn't the source of the knowledge, it's like 3M, Winter makes the knowledge better.

Now this great African empire you mentioned, collapsed under it's own weight and became extinct before Britain(Rome spin-off) made the entire continent their bitch. By comparison, is the the architecture in Washington DC, London, Paris and Berlin inspired by Roman or Egyptian cultures?





None of your "great" empires from Africa/Ottoman/Indian matter very much in the grand scheme of developing the sacred knowledge from Sumer into the modern civilization we have today because cultures that had to endure Winter were motivated to a greater degree to be more technologically efficient and interdependent on one another.

The Annunaki being space aliens theory is full of $#!t.

[Ntikrst]

the arab mathematicians contributed to the familiar arabic numerals and place-value system we are still using today, the decimal system. greek and roman mathematics was held back because of their lack of a place-value system. if you've ever done arithmetic with roman numerals, e.g. LXIII + XCVII = CLX, then you'd notice the inherent superiority of the decimal system, e.g. 63 + 97 = 160. descartes' coordinatization of space in analytic geometry would be impossible without this development. the arab mathematicians also made significant contributions to algebra. the words "algebra" and "algorithm" are still around today to honor their work.

one thing i've always liked about mathematics is the idea that a small handful of really smart people of all skin tones worked on building up this beautiful structure over the centuries, to the benefit of all.

Except the field of Mathematics could only truly flourish in an environment that was afforded by things like democracy, freedom of education and rule of law to protect the rights of individuals. That small handful of people of all skin tones aren't welcome to work on their Math in the Arab world, they do that research mostly in Europe don't they?

What did the Arabs do with their arithmetic? Did they invent mills or internal combustion machines? Did they develop manufacturing or do they just play technological catch up with other cultures who took the Arab contribution to Math and developed it's potential far beyond their wildest dreams?

[Ntikrst]

The Annunaki being space aliens theory is full of $#!t.

Aren't they all?

Monotheism is an insult to rational thought and random Atheism is a pathetic joke.

At least the Annunaki scenario makes sense. It certainly isn't disproven by conjecture and here say from those who disagree because they support nonsensical bullshit.

[Juan Cena]

Aren't they all?

Monotheism is an insult to rational thought and random Atheism is a pathetic joke.

At least the Annunaki scenario makes sense. It certainly isn't disproven by conjecture and here say from those who disagree because they support nonsensical bullshit.

Don't even start trying to drag religion into this.

[Ntikrst]

Don't even start trying to drag religion into this.

"Ancient Aliens" are my religion, motherfucker*.

If you want some respect for yours, you better start showing some for mine.





*I apologize to the Mods if that was out of line, I won't make a habit of it.

[Juan Cena]

"Ancient Aliens" are my religion, motherfucker*.

If you want some respect for yours, you better start showing some for mine.





*I apologize to the Mods if that was out of line, I won't make a habit of it.

So you worship a TV show partially based on the writings of an person with no format archaeological education with a limited ability to translate Sumerian text?