The Outhouse - The Greatest Comic Book Forum

[Chris]

I am saying that the characters have been handled horribly, and the mega-events have failed to deliver. Marvel is doing well, and DC is doing worse, despite the same things affecting both companies.

I may be biased, because I'm definitely enjoying Marvel more at the moment, but pre-IC, I was in the DC camp.. and I'm with you about mega-event fatigue, BUT.. I think Marvel's events have just been produced better. From writing, to marketing, to a general cohesive feel to Marvel's books which brings everything together.

DC is too disjointed right now.

As for characters being handled horribly.. maybe. It certainly happens at both companies, but that has always happened. I mean, there has not been one point in comic history where there haven't been mishandled characters.

[C20Percent]

I'd try a lot more DC, if they just added a freaken recap page.

QFT.

Dan DiDio got this question everywhere last convention season, and his reasoning for not including one is terrible -- so bad I can't remember what it was, but I do remember reading his explanation and thinking, "That's stupid." I'm gonna ask him at Baltimore to reconsider; I read somewhere close to 100 books a month, and it's difficult to remember every detail -- the recap page really helps to stroke my memory.

[Chris]

So when Britney Spears had a #1 album, she's probably the highest quality singer? There's no accounting for taste (good or bad).

I said generally.

There's a reason the Top 20 has the books in it that it does. All those Marvel books are high quality at the moment, and have all been getting critical praise. DC is in a bad shape, and there's a reason for all the negativity surrounding it.

[Sgt.Marvel]

No you wouldn't. Don't lie.

Don't you twist my words around!

[nietoperz]

There things are cyclical. Everything changes.

[Chris]

There things are cyclical. Everything changes.

Yeah, but I really do think that change has to come from uptop.. it's clear that the current regime isn't getting things done.

[Keb]

Don't you twist my words around!

I'm not, I'm just saying you're lying.

There things are cyclical. Everything changes.

You made a grammatical mistake

[nietoperz]

You made a grammatical mistake

No, it was a spelling mistake (typo). I meant to type 'these.'

[Spidey-Man]

There things are cyclical. Everything changes.

Quote Jim Shooter:

It's really funny, talk to people in the business and they say it's... cyclical.


No, it's not cyclical. They sell when the comics are good, they don't when the comics are bad. People who give you that excuse, don't know what they're talking about.


Take a look at the books. Are they good? Are they interesting? Are they readable? Can a civilian read them?

It's really strange, to me, if you have 100 fans, OK, you can do anything to do whatever you want to make Marvel good again. They'd all come with the same thing.

What they'd be saying is get the best people and do good comics. That's not rocket science. 100 fans would come up with the same answer.


But the people who run the company don't get it. Because to them, who have never opened a comic book, a comic book is a bunch of garish colors, words they don't understand, some sell, some don't; they don't know why. They can't tell the difference between an Archie and an X-Men. They tell themselves, it's a cyclical business. Wrong. Everybody in the world knows what to do except the people who have the power to make the decisions.

[Keb]

Yeah, but I really do think that change has to come from uptop.. it's clear that the current regime isn't getting things done.

You're so impatient.

Just wait, let this big event shit blow over. Marvel may have it together now, but they didn't have it together a couple years ago. House of M was a big fuck-up and Avengers Disassembled was awful, while Identity Crisis and Infinite Crisis and all that lead-in did exceptionally well. Now the roles are reversed, and if indeed everything is cyclical, then things will change.

[Sgt.Marvel]

I'm not, I'm just saying you're lying.

Maybe I want to read Final Crisis, but didn't read Countdown and want to know what's going on!

[Spidey-Man]

Since Marvel passed DC circa 1971(?), Marvel has just about always been on top. They once had a 75% share.

But since DC almost tied them in 2004 and there was a lot of DC buzz, and then Marvel has smoked them, I just wonder why.

[nietoperz]

Sorry, but I don't agree with him. One man's meat is another man's poison, Rob. Marvel is, to me, the worst it has ever been just now, while DC is on an uptick. Others see things a different way.

For that reason, Shooter's absolutist ideas are fundamentally misguided, if not outright wrong.

[Keb]

No, it was a spelling mistake (typo). I meant to type 'these.'

I know, but the typo turned it into a grammatical mistake and you NEVER make those.

Stop stomping on my small victories!!!

[Spidey-Man]

You're so impatient.

Just wait, let this big event shit blow over. Marvel may have it together now, but they didn't have it together a couple years ago. House of M was a big fuck-up and Avengers Disassembled was awful, while Identity Crisis and Infinite Crisis and all that lead-in did exceptionally well. Now the roles are reversed, and if indeed everything is cyclical, then things will change.

It just seems like people didn't like whatever Infinite Crisis led to, where let down by IC, and at this point, there's a decent sized difference.