The Outhouse - The Greatest Comic Book Forum

[Rockman]

A good/average novel is going to be better than any comic book I've ever read (aside from maybe Fables).

Novels are just the superior medium. It's sad we never got to see how great Moore could have been because he was content to have the apex work of a very limited medium.

[Doc Jon]

oh yeah I'm sure you can make a good living there.

I just don't think comic books in general should be regarded the same as novels, or even films. They are a limited field.

Many "artists", writers, painters and so on die penniless.

Phillip K. Dick died without any money. I think using money as a measure of genius is simply erroneous...

[Doc Jon]

A good/average novel is going to be better than any comic book I've ever read (aside from maybe Fables).

Novels are just the superior medium. It's sad we never got to see how great Moore could have been because he was content to have the apex work of a very limited medium.

To each their own, but I could not disagree more.

Comics are a unique medium and when you see something like Watchmen, or Maus, or the Dark Knight Returns, they are on par with any other medium out there. Comics is more than the words on the page, it's how those words mesh with the art and how they both tell the story.

When used properly, no other medium matches the ability of comics to tell a story.

[Rockman]

Many "artists", writers, painters and so on die penniless.

Phillip K. Dick died without any money. I think using money as a measure of genius is simply erroneous...

I don't care about money either.

It just happens that writing novels or doing tv/movie works tends to be more lucrative than comic work.

[Doc Jon]

I don't care about money either.

It just happens that writing novels or doing tv/movie works tends to be more lucrative than comic work.

You know how many people out there have tried to write a book or screenplay? Or people that have and never made anything. You're simply talking the most successful film people and the most successful comic people.

It's a bit silly because Aaron Spelling made millions on shit like 90210 and Melrose PLace and shit. Please don't tell me that's genius...

[Rockman]

To each their own, but I could not disagree more.

Comics are a unique medium and when you see something like Watchmen, or Maus, or the Dark Knight Returns, they are on par with any other medium out there. Comics is more than the words on the page, it's how those words mesh with the art and how they both tell the story.

When used properly, no other medium matches the ability of comics to tell a story.

It's true that Watchmen the comic is better than Watchmen the movie (which sucked).

It's an experience unique to the medium.

That doesn't mean that most novels I've read are not wholly more satisfying reads and demand a stronger emotional response.

I love comics, but the industry is a lot crap, a lot of good stuff, a few stories that people would recommend as actual "literature". A I just don't think the masterpieces of comic books compare so well to a good novel, or a good film.

Just because certain stories work better in comics doesn't mean that comics are a better medium than others. It just means that comics have found a couple of good gimmicks.

[Rockman]

You know how many people out there have tried to write a book or screenplay? Or people that have and never made anything. You're simply talking the most successful film people and the most successful comic people.

It's a bit silly because Aaron Spelling made millions on shit like 90210 and Melrose PLace and shit. Please don't tell me that's genius...

I can't comment on those shows I'm a tad young for that sorry.

But I imagine someone of Moore's calibre could easily have produced a huge novel that everyone loved?

I mean it's likely but he never pursued it. And while I agree he's very creative, I don't think we ever got to see just how creative he could be.

[Doc Jon]

It's true that Watchmen the comic is better than Watchmen the movie (which sucked).

It's an experience unique to the medium.

That doesn't mean that most novels I've read are not wholly more satisfying reads and demand a stronger emotional response.

I love comics, but the industry is a lot crap, a lot of good stuff, a few stories that people would recommend as actual "literature". A I just don't think the masterpieces of comic books compare so well to a good novel, or a good film.

Just because certain stories work better in comics doesn't mean that comics are a better medium than others. It just means that comics have found a couple of good gimmicks.

Never said that comics were better. I said unique. Each has their advantages/disadvantages.

Films and tv are easiest for mass consumption. FOr the most part, it requires little imagination since you're fed both dialogue and visuals. Also severely hampered by budget.

Novels are amazing. They are only limited by the skill of the author. There are no budgetary constraints and anything one can imagine is possible.

Comics are very similar but with the added visuals. They still require imagination. When used properly, comics can help create a realized world that neither novels nor tv/movies can match.

[e_galston]

To each their own, but I could not disagree more.

Comics are a unique medium and when you see something like Watchmen, or Maus, or the Dark Knight Returns, they are on par with any other medium out there. Comics is more than the words on the page, it's how those words mesh with the art and how they both tell the story.

When used properly, no other medium matches the ability of comics to tell a story.

you are saying to each their on here, but you really won't let anyone have their own opinion on Moore, anyone who disagrees with you is wrong... how is that "to each their own"

[avengingtitan]

Yeah Comic books are his hobby now. He was good enough to branch out and become a respected author, screen writer and producer.

Exactly. Theres also Man of Action (Casey, Seagle, Kelly, Rouleau), BKV, and a few others. They made a bunch of really well loved comics and pop in from time to time but now mostly do other things.

[Doc Jon]

I can't comment on those shows I'm a tad young for that sorry.

But I imagine someone of Moore's calibre could easily have produced a huge novel that everyone loved?

I mean it's likely but he never pursued it. And while I agree he's very creative, I don't think we ever got to see just how creative he could be.

But again, that's a little silly. Writing isn't the same.

Maybe he was really good at writing in a certain style.

That's like saying "so and so is an amazing novelist but I don't know if he's a genius because he never wrote haikus."

Writing screenplays is different from comics which is different from comic strips which is different from novels and so on... Being amazing at one doesn't mean being good at others.

Look at Kevin Smith. I consider him a decent filmmaker, but I don't think he can write good comics.

[habitual]

oh yeah I'm sure you can make a good living there.

I just don't think comic books in general should be regarded the same as novels, or even films. They are a limited field.

Well Moore has made Times list for the 100 best novels of the year with Watchmen so I don't think there's any real difference at all.

Hab

[Doc Jon]

you are saying to each their on here, but you really won't let anyone have their own opinion on Moore, anyone who disagrees with you is wrong... how is that "to each their own"

I think that there's a difference between not liking a creator and being dismissive of his work.

Also, I feel he's earned the right to say what he wants about the industry he helped define.

I've never said all his work was amazing. Far from it. YOu want to dislike Watchmen or LoEG or V or Tom Strong, go for it. I take issue that he's suddenly some mediocre creator that made an overrated book. Because everyone's entitled to an opinion, but that's simply wrong.

[achilles]

I don't care about money either.

It just happens that writing novels or doing tv/movie works tends to be more lucrative than comic work.

I'll agree, but qualify that. Successful novels can pay well. Keeping in mind that off a hardcover novel priced at say $18, a writer will be lucky to see about $.40 a copy sold. E-pub pays considerably more, depending on where it's published, (Amazon, Smashwords, Barnes and Noble for example), and how much you price it at. Amazon has a price point for example below which the writer only keeps 30%, and above which they keep 70%.

Also, comic books can pay huge. Look at McFarlane. Look at Kirkman or Millar. True, some of that came from movie or TV revenue, but look at the guy who does the manga One Piece, Eiichiro Oda. who earns about $23,000,000 a year, more than half of it from the manga royalties. Of course that's manga, not western comics, still...

[achilles]

Saying he'd prefer his fans not to buy a book is not being a dick to them. Mazzuchelli just said the same thing about a Year One reissue coming out soon.

He said a bit more than that...