The Outhouse - The Greatest Comic Book Forum

by **draco x** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:29 pm

Holland Oats wrote:
Neither is what you just wrote.

Cyke was the one who elevated this whole thing from the get-go. Bottom line. I really don't need to waste time on Cap calling Scott, only to have Scott ignore his calls, or lie to him, or refuse to accept a meeting - at the end of the day, that's pointless because Cap already tried talking to him during Schism and got nothing, and Cap tried talking to him in AvX. Who cares if Cap showed up at his doorstep? All he wanted was to talk to him. Cyke elevated things by starting the fight. There's no arguing against that. That is what happened. Cap wasn't acting like a cop.. he pretty much was a cop, but he didn't abuse his powers, when he easily could. He showed up and tried to talk first.

Yeah, he showed up to take a teenager who clearly did not want to go with the Avengers-hence the reason she ran away from both the Avengers and the X-Men. Even when they showed again at Utopia to take her without her obvious consent, she chose to leave with Wanda as opposed to them. Sorry, but no dice, my friend. Regardless of how much of a dick Cyke is, taking someone who happens to be a teenager against their will is not the way to go about it. Both Scott and Steve obviously don't respect Hope enough to give her a say in this whole matter and just see her as an object to be used.
And also, Scott being a douchebag is basically the end-result of the Quesada Marvel where established characters are turned into villains or dicks for little plausible reason. They did that to Tony in Civil War, Wanda in Avengers Disassembled, Matt in Shadowland and they even made Xavier into a paraplegic Lex Luthor by shoe-horning how he manipulated his own students into X-history. It's basically Scott's turn to be a hero-turned-asshole at the moment. Next up it may be Thor or Peter Parker that turns to the darkside( Oh wait they already did that during the Clone Saga in the 90s).

by **draco x** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:35 pm

Holland Oats wrote:
Not officially confirmed, but all the rumors are heavily pointing to that. Uncanny and X-Men would be combined into a bi-weekly, with him writing. Jason Aaron still writing Wolverine & The X-Men, but that will be on earth.

Well if anyone knows if that's true or not please let me know as I want to know what X-books to avoid now.

by **draco x** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:36 pm

alaska1125 wrote:
No worries...by next Wednsday, we'll be milking the shit out of #7.

This.

by **Chris** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:36 pm

draco x wrote:
Well if anyone knows if that's true or not please let me know as I want to know what X-books to avoid now.

There likely won't be any confirmation until SDCC, but Bleeding Cool is pretty positive.

by **draco x** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:39 pm

Holland Oats wrote:
There likely won't be any confirmation until SDCC, but Bleeding Cool is pretty positive.

Good stuff. As I said before, if Bendis starts writing the X-books I have next to no interest in reading them.

by **alaska1125** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 1:46 pm

draco x wrote:
Good stuff. As I said before, if Bendis starts writing the X-books I have next to no interest in reading them.

It may wind up being solid gold if true, but Hulk and the Agents of Smash is about as stupid sounding as any title I could come up with.

by **dairydead** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:16 pm

draco x wrote:
Yeah, he showed up to take a teenager who clearly did not want to go with the Avengers-hence the reason she ran away from both the Avengers and the X-Men. Even when they showed again at Utopia to take her without her obvious consent, she chose to leave with Wanda as opposed to them. Sorry, but no dice, my friend. Regardless of how much of a dick Cyke is, taking someone who happens to be a teenager against their will is not the way to go about it. Both Scott and Steve obviously don't respect Hope enough to give her a say in this whole matter and just see her as an object to be used.
And also, Scott being a douchebag is basically the end-result of the Quesada Marvel where established characters are turned into villains or dicks for little plausible reason. They did that to Tony in Civil War, Wanda in Avengers Disassembled, Matt in Shadowland and they even made Xavier into a paraplegic Lex Luthor by shoe-horning how he manipulated his own students into X-history. It's basically Scott's turn to be a hero-turned-asshole at the moment. Next up it may be Thor or Peter Parker that turns to the darkside( Oh wait they already did that during the Clone Saga in the 90s).

I feel like you are forgetting that this teenage girl was probably going to blow up the planet.]

by **GHERU** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:13 pm

dairydead wrote:
I feel like you are forgetting that this teenage girl was probably going to blow up the planet.]

Like all the other hosts have?
Why is the assumption that she would have probably blown up the Earth when no other X Man has.
And, if the avengers cared about blowing up the earth, what's with tony trying to blow up a being of pixed energy right next to the earth

by **dairydead** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:16 pm

GHERU wrote:Like all the other hosts have?
Why is the assumption that she would have probably blown up the Earth when no other X Man has.
And, if the avengers cared about blowing up the earth, what's with tony trying to blow up a being of pixed energy right next to the earth

Because the force was doing nothing but destroying planet after planet, unlike previous times. It was pretty safe to assume that it was going to blow up earth as well.

by **GHERU** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:22 pm

dairydead wrote:
Because the force was doing nothing but destroying planet after planet, unlike previous times. It was pretty safe to assume that it was going to blow up earth as well.

The energy backlash would have just bypassed the earth?

by **alaska1125** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:39 pm

GHERU wrote:Like all the other hosts have?
Why is the assumption that she would have probably blown up the Earth when no other X Man has.
And, if the avengers cared about blowing up the earth, what's with tony trying to blow up a being of pixed energy right next to the earth

Cripes...who knows. Maybe the energy would blow away from the Earth? Maybe his snazzy new armor had energy dampeners??? All I know is that Jean Grey (apparently not the fake one since we're refusing to acknowledge that particular storyline) wiped out an entire species. The current Phoenix Force seems to be doing the same. I don't give a crap that Rachel didn't since she only had a portion, or that the Shi-ar dude with the mega-sword didn't since, well, no one cares, but wasn't this force a pretty big concern in the War Song mini? Im unclear what the White Phoenix Room has to do with any of this. I'm just baffled that anyone who has any familiarity with Phoenix storylines condones what's happening and dismisses the Avengers as "fascists".

by **e_galston** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 4:02 pm

There's really been only two characters EVER who have had the full force of the phoenix, Rachel and Jean... so really its a 50/50 of what the force will do. Since Jean destroyed a planet with it, and Rachel was able to control it harness it. But since you know on its way to earth the phoenix force was doing nothing but destroying planets NOT rebuilding them or restarting lost races it was a safe bet that the force was gonna destroy earth. Couple that with someone who really didn't know what her powers were capable of, since she only really had them for not too long before the phoenix came to earth. All indications were that the Phoenix Force was on a path of destruction, not a path of rebirth.

by **GHERU** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 5:07 pm

alaska1125 wrote:
Cripes...who knows. Maybe the energy would blow away from the Earth? Maybe his snazzy new armor had energy dampeners??? All I know is that Jean Grey (apparently not the fake one since we're refusing to acknowledge that particular storyline) wiped out an entire species. The current Phoenix Force seems to be doing the same. I don't give a crap that Rachel didn't since she only had a portion, or that the Shi-ar dude with the mega-sword didn't since, well, no one cares, but wasn't this force a pretty big concern in the War Song mini? Im unclear what the White Phoenix Room has to do with any of this. I'm just baffled that anyone who has any familiarity with Phoenix storylines condones what's happening and dismisses the Avengers as "fascists".

so, the x-men suck because they think "maybe" (probably) Hope can control the Phoenix, but the avengers are awesome because "maybe" blowing up a being made of pur energy will either not obey the laws of physics or Tony has armor strong enough to contain a universal entity?

good to know

I have familiarity with many Phoenix story-lines and the Phoenix has always been dissuaded from destroying the Earth by the people the Avengers took an army to "talk to"

by **alaska1125** » Sat Jun 30, 2012 5:24 pm

GHERU wrote:so, the x-men suck because they think "maybe" (probably) Hope can control the Phoenix, but the avengers are awesome because "maybe" blowing up a being made of pur energy will either not obey the laws of physics or Tony has armor strong enough to contain a universal entity?

good to know

I have familiarity with many Phoenix story-lines and the Phoenix has always been dissuaded from destroying the Earth by the people the Avengers took an army to "talk to"

To be fair, I've not assigned the "suck" or "awesome" designations to anyone here. And honestly, do the laws of physics really apply to the Marvel Universe (or any comic based universe, for that matter)? If so, I'm calling bullshit on about seventy years of stories.

Of course the Phoenix hasn't destroyed the earth. Guess what? Neither has Dr. Doom, Magneto, Galactus, etc., etc., etc... Why? Because Marvel wants to keep publishing comics, not because no one of their fictional characters hasn't actually tried. Phoenix actually destroyed an entire race in its first go-round. It's done it again in this current run. It certainly posed a threat in many appearances in between. That's all I'm saying. To deny it is putting your head in the sand, plugging your ears, and going "nah, nah, nah....can't hear you". It's on paper.

by **PDH** » Sun Jul 01, 2012 11:00 am

Even if the odds were only 50/50 that the earth got destroyed that would be far too huge a risk to take.

Suppose there's only one ice-cream left and I say, 'let's toss a coin to decide which of us gets it.' This is a reasonable bet to make.

Suppose, OTOH, that I said, 'let's toss a coin and if you win you get an ice-cream and I get nothing but if I win I get the ice-cream, your car, your house, your wife and all your money and you get shot in the head.'

The second bet is one that most people wouldn't take and this is not because of the odds of winning, which are exactly the same but because of the consequences.

What makes it a bad bet is the pay-offs.

I would not bet the earth even if I had only a 1 in a million chance of losing the bet and the pay-offs were something extremely valuable to me like £10 billion.

As for the Avenger's plan, I'm quite happy to admit that they're not perfect, either but, presumably, they would argue that the chance that the earth would be destroyed by their actions was nowhere near as high as the chance that it would be destroyed by the actions of the X-Men.

There was always a very high chance of the Earth being destroyed. That's the nature of the Phoenix, no-one could help that. But you want to reduce it as much as possible. That's what the Avengers were trying to do. Meanwhile, the X-Men were making it even worse.