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J.G. Jones comments on final Crisis

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BubbaKanoosh

2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:13 pm

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page ... e&id=18513
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C20Percent

rubber spoon

Postby C20Percent » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:20 pm

I couldn't even get past the first paragraph. :roll: This is what I mean when I say DC is a total mess right now. Just in the past few days I've seen more stupid shit out of those offices -- bring Manhunter back for 8 issues, and then cancel it for the third time.

And this -- this is fucking terrible. The 7th issue hasn't even been solicited yet -- has it? And Jones is already giving up -- just quitting, and what's rich is that Dan DiDio doesn't give a fuck.

I'm sure in a few days we'll hear stories about JG Jones developing cancer of the eyeballs or severe arthritis -- injuries and illness seem to be the popular excuse when comic creators completely fail.
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Zechs

Outhouse Editor

Postby Zechs » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:23 pm

C20Percent wrote:I couldn't even get past the first paragraph. :roll: This is what I mean when I say DC is a total mess right now. Just in the past few days I've seen more stupid shit out of those offices -- bring Manhunter back for 8 issues, and then cancel it for the third time.

And this -- this is fucking terrible. The 7th issue hasn't even been solicited yet -- has it? And Jones is already giving up -- just quitting, and what's rich is that Dan DiDio doesn't give a fuck.

I'm sure in a few days we'll hear stories about JG Jones developing cancer of the eyeballs or severe arthritis -- injuries and illness seem to be the popular excuse when comic creators completely fail.


What's even worse is the treatment of characters going on in the Outsiders. That book just never got off the ground with it's relaunch other than establishing the likeable characters. Now yet another reboot and all but two members of that roster appear to be on it.
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BubbaKanoosh

2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:25 pm

Zechs wrote:What's even worse is the treatment of characters going on in the Outsiders. That book just never got off the ground with it's relaunch other than establishing the likeable characters. Now yet another reboot and all but two members of that roster appear to be on it.


Almost tempted to make a "how would you fix DC" thread.
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C20Percent

rubber spoon

Postby C20Percent » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:31 pm

Zechs wrote:What's even worse is the treatment of characters going on in the Outsiders. That book just never got off the ground with it's relaunch other than establishing the likeable characters. Now yet another reboot and all but two members of that roster appear to be on it.


The Outsiders is another good example of failure in the DC offices -- I'd actually combine that into the whole Chuck Dixon debacle. But yeah, they dropped the ball on that book, and I dropped it after this last issue. I can't support DC books that the own company won't support. And it's crazy because you hear Dan Didio talk about DC properties that constantly fail, and he thinks they fail because of "us."

In Baltimore it was all, "You aren't reading those books so we're not going to make them." Instead of placing the blame on the readers -- or lack thereof -- he should look on the inside. He sucks. A good guy personally, but a total failure, and I don't necessarily think it's his fault -- I think it's just institutional to DC comics. I remember Dan DiDio trying to start an initiative that would fine or dock pay to artists and writers that didn't turn work in on time, and nothing has changed, and nothing will change.
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BubbaKanoosh

2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:33 pm

C20Percent wrote:The Outsiders is another good example of failure in the DC offices -- I'd actually combine that into the whole Chuck Dixon debacle. But yeah, they dropped the ball on that book, and I dropped it after this last issue. I can't support DC books that the own company won't support. And it's crazy because you hear Dan Didio talk about DC properties that constantly fail, and he thinks they fail because of "us."

In Baltimore it was all, "You aren't reading those books so we're not going to make them." Instead of placing the blame on the readers -- or lack thereof -- he should look on the inside. He sucks. A good guy personally, but a total failure, and I don't necessarily think it's his fault -- I think it's just institutional to DC comics. I remember Dan DiDio trying to start an initiative that would fine or dock pay to artists and writers that didn't turn work in on time, and nothing has changed, and nothing will change.


That will never happen. Marvel will have an influx of creative talent coming their way.

Shame, cuz it should happen. 15 years ago, lateness like this never happened. Now its a constant occurance between both Marvel and DC.
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C20Percent

rubber spoon

Postby C20Percent » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:43 pm

BubbaKanoosh wrote:That will never happen. Marvel will have an influx of creative talent coming their way.

Shame, cuz it should happen. 15 years ago, lateness like this never happened. Now its a constant occurance between both Marvel and DC.


Yeah, I remember reading something about it during the Kubert/ActionComics delay problems. I guess it wasn't serious because I couldn't find anything on Google.
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Zechs

Outhouse Editor

Postby Zechs » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:45 pm

C20Percent wrote:The Outsiders is another good example of failure in the DC offices -- I'd actually combine that into the whole Chuck Dixon debacle. But yeah, they dropped the ball on that book, and I dropped it after this last issue. I can't support DC books that the own company won't support. And it's crazy because you hear Dan Didio talk about DC properties that constantly fail, and he thinks they fail because of "us."

In Baltimore it was all, "You aren't reading those books so we're not going to make them." Instead of placing the blame on the readers -- or lack thereof -- he should look on the inside. He sucks. A good guy personally, but a total failure, and I don't necessarily think it's his fault -- I think it's just institutional to DC comics. I remember Dan DiDio trying to start an initiative that would fine or dock pay to artists and writers that didn't turn work in on time, and nothing has changed, and nothing will change.


I'm a masochist I hate the art, the story is servicable, but not the greatest, and thus I'll be dropping the book the moment Batgirl leaves the book which appears to be in December. Which about the only good thing about this all is it allows me to save money for Blackest Night. :-D

The problem with DC though it caters to it's fans then it doesn't. Take for example Nightwing and Batgirl. For years they screwed both characters and then finally they fix one by putting Tomasi on Dick's book.

Cassandra on the other hand has gotten such a raw deal and just when it got good it's gotten worse for her. First her ongoing is canned so DC could parade a new Batwoman, who become's so one dimensional and her writer is so publically hated (probably due to chap22 :P).

Then Cass gets written to crap on a stick by Beechen. Then when Johns cleans up Beechen's fucking mess Beechen again ruins it by having her appear again in Robin and ruins Titans East as well to boot.

Then things start to go well for Cass when she's being written well in B&O playing off characters like Katana and Green Arrow quite well. Then we hear she gets a mini and things seem all right in her fans' eyes. But then we find out her mini is tailored by two people that instantly turn off her fans. Written by the one who ruined her so and drawn by a guy who some hate his work (not me I liked Gotham Underground).

Now just when it appears the book is becoming Batgirl & the Outsiders.. yet again it appears her fans are betrayed by DC and she's out in the cold. If there isn't something done you can expect her fans will once again rise up and dog Didio and company question putting her on a book and not to be written by Beechen.
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BubbaKanoosh

2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:49 pm

C20Percent wrote:Yeah, I remember reading something about it during the Kubert/ActionComics delay problems. I guess it wasn't serious because I couldn't find anything on Google.


Nah, they gave him a slap on the wrist.. :roll:
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C20Percent

rubber spoon

Postby C20Percent » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:53 pm

Batgirl was one of the characters that was discussed at Baltimore, and Dan DiDio says shit like, "Everywhere we go people ask about Cassandra, and we give her a miniseries, and the numbers aren't doing well." And, yeah, that's because Beechen is writing the book. You can't launch a book or character with talent like Beechen -- you've got to go Johns or Tomasi or Rucka, and DC just isn't managing that way.

This is one of the reasons I've started reading books for the author instead of the character -- because I got sick-and-tired of reading my favorite characters poorly written.
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BubbaKanoosh

2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Tue Oct 21, 2008 3:55 pm

C20Percent wrote:Batgirl was one of the characters that was discussed at Baltimore, and Dan DiDio says shit like, "Everywhere we go people ask about Cassandra, and we give her a miniseries, and the numbers aren't doing well." And, yeah, that's because Beechen is writing the book. You can't launch a book or character with talent like Beechen -- you've got to go Johns or Tomasi or Rucka, and DC just isn't managing that way.

This is one of the reasons I've started reading books for the author instead of the character -- because I got sick-and-tired of reading my favorite characters poorly written.


Yep.

Only reason Hal Jordan is starring in a book right now is cuz Johns is heading it.
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Zechs

Outhouse Editor

Postby Zechs » Tue Oct 21, 2008 4:15 pm

C20Percent wrote:Batgirl was one of the characters that was discussed at Baltimore, and Dan DiDio says shit like, "Everywhere we go people ask about Cassandra, and we give her a miniseries, and the numbers aren't doing well." And, yeah, that's because Beechen is writing the book. You can't launch a book or character with talent like Beechen -- you've got to go Johns or Tomasi or Rucka, and DC just isn't managing that way.

This is one of the reasons I've started reading books for the author instead of the character -- because I got sick-and-tired of reading my favorite characters poorly written.


Same here but like chap I can't help myself with DC characters. I'll right the passage to hell to see the light for Cass. Did anyone say that to Didio though about Beechen? And state that was the main reason why her fans haven't bought that book?

You give a book a writer who does the character that book will succeed. Tomasi proves that with Nightwing and GLC. Not to mention I bet Robin has increased with Fab on the book.
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BubbaKanoosh

2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Tue Oct 21, 2008 4:23 pm

they are reading to light torches and cut off heads over at CBR right now.
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C20Percent

rubber spoon

Postby C20Percent » Tue Oct 21, 2008 4:26 pm

Zechs wrote:Same here but like chap I can't help myself with DC characters. I'll right the passage to hell to see the light for Cass. Did anyone say that to Didio though about Beechen? And state that was the main reason why her fans haven't bought that book?


If you question the talent level at DC comics, then Dan DiDio gets defensive, and since you're at a DC Forum you're likely to get booed or whatever. For example, I asked a question about Greg Rucka, and I began the question like this, "I know that Greg Rucka's status with DC changed a few months back..." -- and before I could even finish the question Dan DiDio stopped me and got really defensive about what exactly Greg Rucka's role at DC is -- it's really weird.

I'm sure that DiDio knows that Johns or Tomasi would sell more issue of Batgirl than Beechen, but I guess there's an issue of spreading the writers to thin. So, DiDio crosses America and hears these cries for a Batgirl series, and instead of doing the book right he just tries to strike while the property is hot.

In Baltimore, people were asking about the Suicide Squard and the Freedom Fighters, and Dan DiDio just kept saying, "The numbers weren't good." A complete -- it's not "us" it's "you" attitude.
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john lewis hawk

Founder of The Outhouse

Postby john lewis hawk » Tue Oct 21, 2008 4:27 pm

C20Percent wrote:If you question the talent level at DC comics, then Dan DiDio gets defensive, and since you're at a DC Forum you're likely to get booed or whatever. For example, I asked a question about Greg Rucka, and I began the question like this, "I know that Greg Rucka's status with DC changed a few months back..." -- and before I could even finish the question Dan DiDio stopped me and got really defensive about what exactly Greg Rucka's role at DC is -- it's really weird.

I'm sure that DiDio knows that Johns or Tomasi would sell more issue of Batgirl than Beechen, but I guess there's an issue of spreading the writers to thin. So, DiDio crosses America and hears these cries for a Batgirl series, and instead of doing the book right he just tries to strike while the property is hot.

In Baltimore, people were asking about the Suicide Squard and the Freedom Fighters, and Dan DiDio just kept saying, "The numbers weren't good." A complete -- it's not "us" it's "you" attitude.
Dc should hire me to write the books then it's the fans' fault for not picking up my greatness.

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