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Shadowpact question

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Shadowpact question

Postby Strict31 » Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:30 am

I was re-reading the first few issues of Shadowpact the other day, and something struck me. Remember the scene where Superman, Green Lantern and Phantom Strnager are discussing the Blood Barrier? PS says he can open a path into the thing and Superman is all ready to go.

Obviously, since Supes has his...weakness or whatever to magic, PS says he's a bad choice. Magical threats need magical champions.

First time I read it, I didn't think anything of this logic because it's Shadowpact's book, not anther title in which Superman stars. But the second time I read it, I was thinking, maybe Green Lantern could'a handled that mess. He doesn't have any vulnerabilities to magic like Superman does, and as a GL, his willpower is pretty damned hardcore. He probably could have resisted Strega's influence magic, I'm thinking.

Of course, we know why Stranger didn't let GL go in or just wait a few more minutes for the entire rest of the JLA to teleport in (or whoever was on call at the time this story was supposed to occur). I mean, again, it's Shadowpact's book; they're the stars, not GL or Supes or the JLA.

So, here's the question: do you think this could have been a job for Green Lantern? Or was it a task that only Shadowpact could resolve as Phantom Stranger seemed to believe?
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Postby Keb » Mon Aug 04, 2008 3:23 am

Green Lantern was drinking that time so he was a no-go...
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Postby jza1218 » Mon Aug 04, 2008 7:51 am

Depends which Green Lantern. If it was Alan Scott then he would have been distracted by the Old Country Buffet. If it was John Stewart, he'd have been too lazy to do anything.

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Postby C20Percent » Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:01 am

Karnevil would have gutted GL while he was distracted.

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Postby Strict31 » Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:00 pm

C20Percent wrote:Karnevil would have gutted GL while he was distracted.


How? With his entirely normal knife that didn't do him much good against a chimpanzee that schooled his ass?
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Postby Strict31 » Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:01 pm

jza1218 wrote:Depends which Green Lantern. If it was Alan Scott then he would have been distracted by the Old Country Buffet. If it was John Stewart, he'd have been too lazy to do anything.


The Green lantern who was standing right there with Superman and Phantom Stranger. Hal Jordan.
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Postby john lewis hawk » Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:05 pm

I imagine sending in Green Lantern would be like asking a physicist to come up with a strategy for war. While the physicist is intelligent, he doesn't have the training to do a really good job with it. He may even make it worst. You need a general for it. It's the same thing with GL: while he's a capable superhero, he doesn't have the magical training to be able to change the spells and actions of the super-villain group.

Also, it probably helps in this decision that the villain group was almost mirror images of the Shadowpact.

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Postby Strict31 » Mon Aug 04, 2008 4:57 pm

john lewis wrote:I imagine sending in Green Lantern would be like asking a physicist to come up with a strategy for war. While the physicist is intelligent, he doesn't have the training to do a really good job with it. He may even make it worst. You need a general for it. It's the same thing with GL: while he's a capable superhero, he doesn't have the magical training to be able to change the spells and actions of the super-villain group.

Also, it probably helps in this decision that the villain group was almost mirror images of the Shadowpact.


Seems to me the only member of Shadowpact who was effective in bringing the barrier down was Enchantress. The rest of the struggle was a matter of beating people up beater than the other guys could. Which they actually never really did.

I guess what I'm saying is, Hal Jordan ain't exactly a newcomer to facing powerful threats singlehandedly and winning. And as a member of the JLA, he's not exactly a newbie when it comes to facing down magical foes either.

And that ring is pretty darned versatile.

And, he's already on-site.

The sense that I got was that except for his magic vulnerability, which is inconsistent at best, Superman would have been the most logical choice to go in. And he's not nearly as versatile as GL is. And since GL is both there and lack Supes' magic vulnerability....

They decided instead to wait for the guys who got captured moments after they entered, and only managed to escape because one of the enemy let them go.

That Phantom Stranger has insights beyond those of the mortal audience, I guess.

Again, I know it's not GL's title, so he's not gonna be the star. And he should not be the star in someone else's book. But the characters do not know they're starring in someone else's book. Maybe GL was just busy, but it seems like he deferred a bit too quickly.
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Postby chap22 » Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:06 pm

why you gotta bust balls?
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Postby jza1218 » Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:25 pm

Strict31 wrote:The Green lantern who was standing right there with Superman and Phantom Stranger. Hal Jordan.


Oh. Then he'd get too distracted by titties and he'd die a tragic death as a result

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Postby KING King Impulse » Mon Aug 04, 2008 6:29 pm

Magic isn't a weakness to Superman in the way that Kryptonite is, he's just as vulnerable to it as your average joe.
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Postby Strict31 » Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:19 am

Kid Impulse wrote:Magic isn't a weakness to Superman in the way that Kryptonite is, he's just as vulnerable to it as your average joe.


If Thor slaps the average joe with his magic hammer, the average joe gets turned into a red paste.

So, is that what would happen to Superman? Cuz it didn't seem to be the case in JLA/Avengers...
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Postby John Q. » Tue Aug 05, 2008 3:54 am

Strict31 wrote:If Thor slaps the average joe with his magic hammer, the average joe gets turned into a red paste.

So, is that what would happen to Superman? Cuz it didn't seem to be the case in JLA/Avengers...


Yeah, but JLA/Avengers was balls.

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Postby Strict31 » Tue Aug 05, 2008 8:14 am

John Q. wrote:Yeah, but JLA/Avengers was balls.


Did anybody really think that DC was gonna let Superman, the posterboy of superheroes, get whupped by Thor? No matter how logical it might have been. If his magic vulnerability/weakness/whatever-the-hell-it-is was written consistently, and he was indeed as vulnerable to it as any normal human, Superman would have been turned to paste or eviscerated or vaporized by one or more magical threats years ago.

Because it's one thing to be punched by a magical being with the proportionate strength and speed of someone bitten by a radioactive Zatanna. Another thing entirely to be hammered by a magical dude with the strength of Captain Marvel. How well will a normal human stand up to magical strength that can lift as much as Superman can?

But still, that's far from the point of this thread, since Green Lantern has no such weakness to magic.
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Postby chap22 » Tue Aug 05, 2008 9:00 am

Strict31 wrote:If Thor slaps the average joe with his magic hammer, the average joe gets turned into a red paste.

So, is that what would happen to Superman? Cuz it didn't seem to be the case in JLA/Avengers...
nope.

first things first, let's try and differentiate here:

Thor's hammer is enchanted. that means it's been gifted with certain strengths and powers by magic, but in and of itself it does very little "magic" itself. it can call down/create storms (which in and of themselves are only "magical" in that they appear where they shouldn't; Thor doesn't make special lightning that turns water into a flagon of mead when it strikes it), it can create dimensional vortexes when swung really fast with some magical aid attached to it, it can change Thor into his civilian identity, it automatically returns to Thor's hand, can only be lifted by he who is worthy, and a couple other little things. these are enchantments placed on the hammer, not magic which the hammer does itself. the hammer doesn't just point at people and turn them to toads like say Zatanna or Doc Strange can do.

Thor slapping the average Joe with his hammer doesn't paste said Joe because it's magic, it's because it's a solid metal hammer swung with the strength of a Class-100 (or 80, or 90, or whatever he was, to bust out some old-school OHOTMU jargon) god of thunder. if Thor swung a 5-dollar claw hammer from the local Home Depot it'd pulp an average Joe.


Supes' vulnerability to magic is more along the lines of: if Tannarak or Ian Karkull or Dormammu or somebody spun a spell to put people to sleep, or change them into frogs, etc, Supes' "invulnerability" doesn't stop that. he'd be sawing logs or ribbiting just like you or me. he can't disrupt a magic force field just by giving it a love-tap. if somebody tries to send him to a mystical nether-dimension, he better hope he packed a toothbrush in his cape pocket. but facing somebody with magic-imbued strength doesn't automatically mean his punches have no effect, or that he can't use his heat vision to fry 'em. his strength and his powers are still there, and still work. he just has to make the fight one of physicality, not his powers against spells.
Last edited by chap22 on Tue Aug 05, 2008 9:19 am, edited 3 times in total.
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