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"THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

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guitarsmashley
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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby guitarsmashley » Thu Oct 24, 2013 8:46 am

Great, another #1 with the same creative team more or less continuing a story. Marvel doesn't need to out DC right now DC is doing a good enough a job at screwing themselves 11 months of the year.
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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Chris » Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:36 am

guitarsmashley wrote:Great, another #1 with the same creative team more or less continuing a story. Marvel doesn't need to out DC right now DC is doing a good enough a job at screwing themselves 11 months of the year.

Could not care less about a number on the cover. Just keep writing good shit.
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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby The Shadow » Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:57 am

Chris wrote:Could not care less about a number on the cover. Just keep writing good shit.

This.

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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby TimDrake'sDumbWings » Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:16 pm

Yeah, I feel like--as long as they keep the creative teams--renumberings matter even less now that I've switched to digital.

Now I just hope that the big changes coming to Matt's life are interesting!

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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Punchy » Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:17 pm

Nooooooooooooooooo

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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby TimDrake'sDumbWings » Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:22 pm

Oh. I forgot about the inevitable $1 price increase that'll come with this.

Bastards.

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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby misac » Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:35 pm

Renumbering is dumb but if Waid’s still writing DD I don’t care. Same with PAD on X-Factor.
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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Arion » Thu Oct 24, 2013 3:27 pm

Chessack wrote:Man, these guys reboot series more often than a Windows 3.1 computer. (Who is old enough to get that joke?)

This is like the Kelly Sue/Captain Marvel thing. I mean, what is the need to end a series and re-start it when the SAME creative team is staying on it and, presumably, the overall continuity is not being re-started or changed in a major way? "Oh we're going to send Captain Marvel into space now," is a good reason to start a new story arc, but not a new SERIES. I mean come on. They are just milking the #1s now.

At what point are the customers going to wake up, realize this is a scam, and stop rewarding it? Or has that ship sailed long ago? Have Marvel and DC already weeded out the 80% of former comic collectors who detest this kind of gimmick, causing most of them to stop buying comics or move on to indies? Are the only collectors left the people who fall for this shit?


I had Windows 95 but I get the joke.

The obsession for a new #1 has always been there. DC and Marvel are capitalizing on it.

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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Stephen Day » Thu Oct 24, 2013 4:12 pm

Chris wrote:Could not care less about a number on the cover. Just keep writing good shit.


I agree, I don't get the big deal that people make about a number on the cover. All I care about is the story inside the cover. :smt102
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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Chessack » Thu Oct 24, 2013 4:24 pm

Arion wrote:The obsession for a new #1 has always been there. DC and Marvel are capitalizing on it.


Actually, it hasn't.

In the pre-Crisis era, very few comics got rebooted, and getting to high numbers of continuous print comics was a badge of honor. There was a sense that Marvel would always be screwed in that department because they started so much later than DC did that they could never catch up. The closest they had was Journey into Mystery, because Thor started on #82 of that series, and they never renumbered it because it was their highest-numbered comic.

Back in the day, the milestones used to be important. Companies would frequently double-size issue 25, 50, 75, 100, 150, 200, 250, etc. Most of the time (though not all), these milestone issues wrapped up major stories. Rom 25 wrapped up the Galador storyline, for example. Thor 350 was originally slated to wrap up the Surtur saga but it got so big that although Simonson double-sized it, he still needed 3 more issues to finish the story. The list goes on and on.

With the reboot mentality, comics rarely reach 50 or 75 anymore, and almost never 100. So are we really sure that just putting another #1 out there on what would have been DareDevil 37, is really going to sell better than if they did a "double sized anniversary 50th issue" a few months later?

The numbers used to mean something. Comics were the only periodical that had sequential numbers like this. Every other periodical goes by volume and issue number, e.g. vol 1, issues 1-12, then the next year is vol. 2, issues 1-12, and so on. The way they are doing things now, they may as well just number them like a regular magazine. That would give them their #1 issue every single year.

But it also means that the numbers mean nothing. Remember, nobody knows "what issue" Discover magazine is on. It's been published for 33 years, 10 issues per year. So this month's Discover is (roughly) #330. But they don't call it that. They call it "the October issue of Discover."

So if comics are going to make numbering irrelevant (which is what all this rebooting is doing) then they may as well go all the way and do it like that.

What they don't realize, and what collectors don't realize, is that what made #1s valuable back in the day was their rarity. When Captain America has 5 #1 issues in a 10-year period, then the #1 issue loses its value. As can be seen from the fact that back-issue prices for these things rarely go up anymore.

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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Johnny Smith » Thu Oct 24, 2013 4:34 pm

Glad Waid will be on the book after this era ends :-D
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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Amoebas » Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:50 pm

Chessack wrote:
Actually, it hasn't.

In the pre-Crisis era, very few comics got rebooted, and getting to high numbers of continuous print comics was a badge of honor. There was a sense that Marvel would always be screwed in that department because they started so much later than DC did that they could never catch up. The closest they had was Journey into Mystery, because Thor started on #82 of that series, and they never renumbered it because it was their highest-numbered comic.

Back in the day, the milestones used to be important. Companies would frequently double-size issue 25, 50, 75, 100, 150, 200, 250, etc. Most of the time (though not all), these milestone issues wrapped up major stories. Rom 25 wrapped up the Galador storyline, for example. Thor 350 was originally slated to wrap up the Surtur saga but it got so big that although Simonson double-sized it, he still needed 3 more issues to finish the story. The list goes on and on.

With the reboot mentality, comics rarely reach 50 or 75 anymore, and almost never 100. So are we really sure that just putting another #1 out there on what would have been DareDevil 37, is really going to sell better than if they did a "double sized anniversary 50th issue" a few months later?

The numbers used to mean something. Comics were the only periodical that had sequential numbers like this. Every other periodical goes by volume and issue number, e.g. vol 1, issues 1-12, then the next year is vol. 2, issues 1-12, and so on. The way they are doing things now, they may as well just number them like a regular magazine. That would give them their #1 issue every single year.

But it also means that the numbers mean nothing. Remember, nobody knows "what issue" Discover magazine is on. It's been published for 33 years, 10 issues per year. So this month's Discover is (roughly) #330. But they don't call it that. They call it "the October issue of Discover."

So if comics are going to make numbering irrelevant (which is what all this rebooting is doing) then they may as well go all the way and do it like that.

What they don't realize, and what collectors don't realize, is that what made #1s valuable back in the day was their rarity. When Captain America has 5 #1 issues in a 10-year period, then the #1 issue loses its value. As can be seen from the fact that back-issue prices for these things rarely go up anymore.


MARVEL COULD Take notice that the best selling book last year was a number 100 (Walking Dead) but, it seems they'd rather try to grab the speculators (who don't really exist anymore).

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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Victorian Squid » Thu Oct 24, 2013 6:10 pm

Marvel does this because they get a ton of publicity and a bunch of people who jump on to try a book out from that hype. If it works, they keep doing it. And it's worked well for them lately.

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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby GiveWarAChance » Thu Oct 24, 2013 8:26 pm

They better put "collectors item" on that new #1 issue or I'll be pissed.
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Re: "THIS era of Daredevil is coming to an end"

Postby Chessack » Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:44 pm

Victorian Squid wrote:Marvel does this because they get a ton of publicity and a bunch of people who jump on to try a book out from that hype. If it works, they keep doing it. And it's worked well for them lately.


Yes, I know it works. People say "Oh look, a NEW version of Daredevil" (or something like that), "let me try it and see if it's any good."

By the way, that's why I said above that customers need to wake up and see it for the scam it is. Someone said it's not really a scam -- but in cases like this, yes, it is. If the same team is following the same continuity of the same character, then calling the issue after 36, #1 instead of #37, is a scam. Because it's not a "new" Daredevil. It's the same old one. Anyone who picks it up thinking it's an actual restart, reboot, or equivalent, will be mistaken. And Marvel WANTS them to be mistaken. Because if they thought just continuing the same character with the same creative team would sell the comic, they'd number it as #37, not #1.

Note, I'm not calling ALL #1 issues a scam. A truly new series, like Lazarus or Rocket Girl or Velvet (to name a few recently started series with recent #1s) of course should get a #1 issue. And a true reboot, like Red Sonja by Gail Simone, where they gave Sonja a whole new creative team, and they started the story over again, and are pretty much ignoring the entire 80-issue series that came before, are probably worthy of a renumbering. If you are going to throw out or make obsolete all the issues that came before, then it is fair to signal to the readers that this new series is not directly connected to the old. In this case, much (but not all) of the New 52 renumbering was fair. (This isn't to say that the New 52 wasn't a giant gimmick, but Supergirl 1 and Justice League 1 and so on were fair in the sense that they threw out all the continuity that came before.)

But this Daredevil thing, and the Captain Marvel announcement before it, is truly a scam, because nothing is being changed. There's not a new creative team. They aren't rebooting the character with a brand new origin and backstory. The old history/continuity is in place. All that's happening is they are starting a new story arc. And it gets a renumber? No... that is a head-fake to trick people who have not been reading the series into trying it, by tricking them into thinking that it's something new, when it's really, truly, just the next issue in the series.

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