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Uncanny Avengers #4

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The Goddamn Bat-min

Postby nietoperz » Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:35 pm

Magneto's estimation comes from his (claimed) knowledge of Scott Summers as opposed to the P-Force. And remember, the 'Jean' that destroyed that planet wasn't the actual Jean Grey, rather a Phoenix-created facsimile.
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Outhouse Editor

Postby Zechs » Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:36 pm

BlueMole wrote:I'm impressed with how well-preserved Xavier's corpse is after 11 years.

Related note, I hope that Xavier's Well Preserved Corpse becomes a major Marvel villain. That's story potential for years to come.

Me too. But maybe that's why heroes don't harm Chuck's body. It's so darn well preserved. :P

BlueMole wrote:
So Magneto, whose knowledge of the Phoenix Force rivals that of Wolverine, claims that Cyclops really wanted to kill Xavier and that makes it the truth? I'm sure Jean Grey really wanted to kill a planet full of aliens, too, deep down.

I'm probably just reading too much into it in order to stir up more controversy. :P

She did, but Wanda wiping out all mutants? Nope she didn't want that deep down. Nope no sir.
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The Red Stands for Irony

Postby BlueStreak » Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:38 pm

nietoperz wrote:Magneto's estimation comes from his (claimed) knowledge of Scott Summers as opposed to the P-Force. And remember, the 'Jean' that destroyed that planet wasn't the actual Jean Grey, rather a Phoenix-created facsimile.

Hasn't Marvel decided that they're ignoring that plot point? Why should my trumped up outrage be stalled by a retcon that didn't get mentioned during the summer of the Phoenix?

I'll just going to Motteditor it up and say that Captain Fascist and the Uncanny Uncle Toms is a mediocre comic.
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Postby mrorangesoda » Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:08 pm

nietoperz wrote:
I'll see your claim and raise you Bloodwynd.

He wasn't horrible in the background of Morrison's JLA :smt102
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Rain Partier

Postby chap22 » Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:21 pm

nietoperz wrote:
I'll see your claim and raise you Bloodwynd.

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Zombie Guard

Postby Zero » Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:23 pm

BlueMole wrote:Other notes:

This arc opens with Havok, Wolverine and other assorted heroes getting pissed at Cyclops for killing someone while possessed. This arc ends with Havok and team telling people that they weren't responsible for deaths caused while possessed by the Red Skull. I can't decide if that's a deliberate attempt at bookending or just more hypocritical bullshit from Cap's Goon Squad.

Can't it just be bad writing? God knows there's enough of it in Claremont's endless captions to spill out into the rest of the comic. What? Claremont didn't write them? Bullshit. Rick Remender is just Claremont Catfishing us all, mark my words!
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<( ' . ' )>

Postby Keb » Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:27 pm

Haven't read the issue yet but from the previous 3 and the previews it looks like this series is going to be more Fanboy Wankathon than Continuity tribute.

I had high hopes for Remender.
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Draco x


Postby Draco x » Wed Feb 27, 2013 4:56 pm

I liked Onslaught in the 90s when he first came out but I am worried that they will fuck him up again like that god awful Onslaught Reborn series awhile back. With that said, the Red Skull face mask just looks weird.
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2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:06 pm

Cool stuff re: Uncanny Avengers According to an interview, cool things are planned. Oh, and better art. Here are some tidbits:

"Time travel of course means Kang will be playing a large role in this series and you'll get your first real taste of what he is up to in issue #5. It serves as a big sequel piece to 'The Dark Angel Saga' story line from my 'Uncanny X-Force' run. It's where we start to lay the foundation for the 24 issues of insanity that we're embarking upon."

Kang and his future incarnation Immortus won't be the only time travelers involved in the upcoming action of "Uncanny Avengers." Remender also has plans for the time traveling criminal that would become Kang, Rama-Tut.

"Writing Kang and his various incarnations is tricky. You've got Immortus who's the older Kang, who is trying to be a better man. You've got Kang who is this conqueror that wants to win battles and dominate, but always through honor. So he can time travel and change history to suit his purposes, but only when it's absolutely necessary. He wants to win on the field of battle for the most part," Remender explained. "Kang has this sort of mixed ethical compass. He's clearly a scumbag, but he's somewhat of an honorable one. Then you have Rama Tut who I see as the younger, more confused, and ultimately more evil of the Kang and Immortus incarnations.

"In issue #6 we get a lot of what Rama Tut has been doing and it's complicated,' Remender continued with a laugh. "I've got a giant map on my wall that's connected in almost 'A Beautiful Mind' style way and documents how the time travel works. You won't understand everything that's going on until around issue #17 when a big reveal drops."

The dialogue in the three-month flash-forward sequence also made reference to two other time travelers: Cable, who recently encountered the Uncanny Avengers in the pages of "Cable & X-Force," and Ahab. the villainous cyborg that served as master of the "hounds" in the "Days of Future Past" reality. "With Cable, I don't want to spoil any of the plans we have for further down the road, but ['Cable & X-Force' writer] Dennis Hopeless and I have had some conversations about interconnections between our two books," Remender remarked. "And to me, Ahab is one of the architects of the 'Days of Future Past' time line. He's the guy that's training the 'hounds' and he's the guy that's responsible for a lot of the evil experiments and concentration camps in that future time line. He was always a very interesting villain and one I thought there was a lot of intrigue being built around; especially dealing with the modern version of him that was stumbling around.

"That all kind of fizzled as writers were changed and that thread with Ahab was never picked back up. I know it was hit on a couple times but it was never explored the way I always wanted it to be explored," Remender continued. "So we're alluding to Ahab in issue #4 because... you'll see."

The Red Skull established his presence as a major villainous player in the debut issue of "Uncanny Avengers" when he stole Charles Xavier's telepathic abilities by grafting the late mutant's brain onto his own. The flash-forward in issue #4 suggested that when the Skull returns to menace the Avengers Unity Division he will be even more dangerous: the final page revealed that the Red Skull had merged with the being created from the darkest portions of Xavier's consciousness, Onslaught.

"Early on in the development of this series, Jeph Loeb suggested at a retreat that I try to develop Red Skull as the villain. Upon sitting down to do this, I found it to be incredibly difficult. Because I kept picturing Red Skull standing there with Captain America, Rogue, Thor, Scarlet Witch, Havok and Wolverine all charging at him. The next scene from that is that the Red Skull gets beaten up really badly," Remender said with a laugh. "Of course he'd have machinations and all sorts of wonderful traps and henchmen, but it wasn't a very satisfying thing for me. Then my mind went to the Cosmic Cube, but I thought, 'Really? Every single time we see this guy he's going to have a new Marvel Universe power relic?' It makes the character, in terms of being an Avengers level threat, not work no matter how smart, mischievous or conniving he is. So that's where the idea to use the brain of Charles Xavier came from.

"Charles' brain isn't just a relic and with Zola's help he bio welds it into his own head. It also gave the Red Skull mask a little more importance because it houses Xavier's brain. It made him a much more interesting character," Remender continued. "Then as I was developing the story I needed an escalation for a big villain reveal. The previous escalation was that the Red Skull is now as powerful as Charles Xavier, but I couldn't figure out the next step up from there. I wanted something that grew naturally out of the merging of Red Skull and Charles Xavier. That was when my editor Tom Brevoort mentioned Onslaught.

The ranks of the "Uncanny Avengers" will grow in issue #5 with the addition of Wasp, Sunfire, and Wonder Man who will play a limited role on the team. "With Wonder Man you've got somebody who's got a long term relationship with Wanda. She is responsible for him being alive and he's still very much in love with her. So that's a very complicated relationship," Remender said. "Plus, Wonder Man is basically Superman, but he's now a pacifist. He recently came to see that nothing good comes from fighting and that the Avengers are causing as much trouble as they're solving. So he's here to help with the mansion, their PR, and to try and win back Wanda. He's not going to fight though. I love the idea that when the shit goes down and you're in it that you turn to Superman and say, 'help.' Then he says 'I'm a pacifist.' So that's got a lot of grist and there's a lot of drama that I'm building on with that.

"Then, for me, Wasp is as much the traditional leader of the Avengers as Captain America. She was the chairwoman of the Avengers for a long, long time and in my mind she's not just a great tactician and field leader. She's got ideas based on her skills as a fashion designer on how to help mutants change their PR, and how to structure an image that helps people get their head around liking mutants," Remender continued. "She has a line in issue #5 where she says, 'You'll never make their parents like you, but if you make the kids think you're cool you win the next generation.' So she's got all kinds of ideas for a line of fashions and a PR campaign that's going to help clean up the image of mutants for the general population in the Marvel Universe. Beyond that, she's a terrific character. She's smart, sassy and sexy. I really like Wasp a lot and I'm excited to build her back up."

With Sunfire, Remender has a character with a unique perspective that enlivens the group dynamic of the Uncanny Avengers. "Sunfire is noble, but he's a nationalist that only really cares about Japan. So he sees the opportunity to be in the Avengers as something that helps that image and helps his nation," the writer said. "Plus, as a former Horseman he's got a lot of the same connective tissues that a character like Archangel had when dealing [with] the Akkaba and [the] Apocalypse stuff I'm building. So there's a lot of fun stuff there, but beyond that I like having a character who's an unapologetic asshole on the team just for the dialogue," Remender said with a laugh. "It's fun to have somebody point out how ridiculous something may be or to make fun of a character behaving in a stereotypical or clichéd way. So I just like the idea of Sunfire being a dick."

Sunfire's attitude is certain to rub many of his teammates the wrong way, especially Wolverine, who became the unofficial heir to Xavier's dream after opening a new school for mutants. That status means he'll feel obligated to see past Sunfire's obnoxiousness and try and realize Xavier's hopes for the Japanese mutant.

As Remender hinted earlier, upcoming issues of "Uncanny Avengers" will have the team working together for the greater good by trying to defeat the threat of Kang and the mysterious Apocalypse Twins. "This book is all one big narrative, and the inciting incident of these first four issues is the powering up of Red Skull and the team's formation. The first thing that they're dealing with after that is the Apocalypse twins," Remender remarked. "In issue #6 we'll get a flashback where we see Thor, Rama Tut, Apocalypse and Kang in a conflict that creates a relic that we've currently been seeing in Jason Aaron's 'Thor: God of Thunder' series. It's Thor's axe. We'll see why the Axe is now the most powerful relic in the Marvel Universe, how it became that, and what role it's going to play moving forward.

And finally, which sounds fucking awesome:

Remender plans to follow up "Ragnarok Now" with a story that will examine the repercussions of several Marvel Universe characters discovering what the Red Skull did to Charles Xavier's brain. "It's fascinating to imagine what might happen if someone like Magneto discovered that the Red Skull had taken Charles Xavier's brain and was using it to kill mutants," the writer said. "It seems like Magneto wouldn't be super excited about something like that and it might lead to some conflict. It might lead to some conflict between Scott Summers and Alex Summers as well. So there's a lot of fun stuff coming up."

Interview here: ... e&id=43969





I know, long post. Sorry.
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fieldy snuts

Rain Partier

Postby fieldy snuts » Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:59 pm

He get's Kang. I'm sticking around with this for that alone. Dunno if I agree with him about Immortus being a good guy though :lol:

This looks like an even crazier mash up than X-Force ever was. Hope we get as good a payoff for this.
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2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:09 pm

Kang goes thru time to make sure he conquers. Immortus is more the "time cop" and corrector of temporal shit.
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2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:15 pm

Also Wanda and Havok get all lovey dovey
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<( ' . ' )>

Postby Keb » Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:19 pm

This is why I trust Remender, but if this shit takes waaaay too much time for some seriously boring comics, I'll just jump off the train and start picking something else up.
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2009 Most Valuable Poster

Postby BubbaKanoosh » Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:23 pm

Keb wrote:This is why I trust Remender, but if this shit takes waaaay too much time for some seriously boring comics, I'll just jump off the train and start picking something else up.

Him and Hickman are both like that.
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Motherfucker from Hell

Postby TimDrake'sDumbWings » Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:26 pm

Yeah, I think I'm done with this book. This is not the Reminder I know and love. The last two issues just fucking dragged, thanks in no small part to the droning narration. With the upcoming story arc expected to last more than 12 issues, Remender is asking us to invest a lot while showing us very little worth investing in. I might come back to this if I hear good things and Comixology puts it on sale, but I'm not sticking around for the foreseeable future, especially if I have to deal with Acuña art all too soon.

Also, has anyone anywhere ever given a fuck about Onslaught?

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